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Friday, March 24, 2017

Dems, GOP must listen to voters

Posted Wednesday, December 5, 2012, at 8:31 AM

Once more over the cliff my little lemmings, once once more over the cliff.

We now have less than 30 days for Congress and the administration to do something it hasn't been able to do in four years -- adopt a budget. Let alone one that's balanced, or, heaven forbid, one that actually addresses the issue of the national debt.

Our debt wasn't all that bad until Bush came into office. His father and his father's successor had both done reasonably good jobs controlling spending, but all of "Dubya's" budgets were only "balanced" because, unlike his own successor, he didn't bother to put the cost of his wars in his main budget. Little things like Iraq, Afghanistan, Katrina and all the long-term care for our injured veterans (estimated at $3 trillion alone), got put on credit cards, with the bills starting to come through today. At least the current guy in the White House puts the wars and the VA costs for wounded vets in his budgets. Battlefield medicine has gotten so good that a lot of people survive with horrific, permanent injuries, who would have died in previous wars. The "entitlement" they've earned should never be denied -- even if they're included in those mindless "we've got to cut all entitlements to the moochers" arguments.

Then the economy melted down right at the end of Dubya's term (due to poor oversight during his term and that of his predecessor) and the current administration immediately pulled out those same credit cards, adopting an economic policy originally used by FDR to stall and then end the Great Depression, but not nearly as effectively this time around with the Great Recession.

Finally, the Tea Party came along, voting on complex issues using the type of simplistic thinking usually reserved only for posters and bumper stickers on the back end of beat-up pickups, and suddenly we have a self-created and entirely artificial fiscal cliff staring us in the face, with true economic armageddon on the other side. It's a long way to the bottom of that cliff, people.

Both sides in this argument have a part of the solution. They just seem incapable of putting the best parts of those ideas together.

The Republicans seem oblivious to the fact that their basic line in the sand was obliterated during a crushing defeat at the polls just a few weeks ago. The Democrats, however, seem to have gotten a little arrogant over that victory and dug in their heels. So far, on both sides of the aisle, only a handful of Republicans have stepped up to the plate in a spirit of true compromise -- and they're getting the political equivalent of death threats from the right wing of their own party.

Anybody with any brains can see that there are two basic legs to this equation.

First, the federal government needs some additional revenue.

They've pretty much scraped the bottom of the barrel in terms of hidden-cost fees and user taxes, so it's back to tax rates. Both sides want the Bush-era tax cuts for the middle class to continue (so do we -- very much). The alternative is to see a hike of at least $2,200 a year, a huge percentage increase in federal taxes for the average American -- the little guy.

The sticking point is asking millionaires and billionaires to pay 1-2 percent more in taxes. Remember, this is essentially the upper 1 percent, who have acquired 93 percent of the economic growth that's occurred in the last ten years, and which is sitting on record amounts of cash (we're talking records in terms of world history), while waiting for the little guy on Main Street to restart the economy for them. Then they can swoop in, buy everybody out, and take credit for utopia.

For some unknown reason, the GOP has abandoned the Main Street businessman it used to champion, giving only lip service to those people it should represent, and become the voice instead of the ultra-rich oligarchs. They have become so beholden to those oligarchs they would rather hold the rest of the country hostage, and threaten economic doom for all but those who can afford to ride it out, rather than give in on this point.

Keep in mind, these increases are in personal income taxes only (tax rate cuts for businesses actually make sense in terms of world competitiveness), and there are so many deductions for the rich that aren't accessible to the average citizen that usually the rich pay far less of a percentage in practice than the average American. Mitt Romney, for example, paid about three percent less on his income than the average middle class Joe, and people like Warren Buffett and Bill Gates usually pay pretty close to zero income tax, thanks to all the loopholes put in for the rich by the rich.

And that's one of the problems. Congress is overwhelming filled with millionaires. These are the same guys who give themselves much better pension and health care insurance than is available to all the rest of us. What are the chances they're going to take money out of their own pockets-- make the kind of sacrifice they say all the rest of us have to make -- in order to improve the country? It would be a stunning reversal of both history and human nature if they did.

The second leg of the fiscal crisis is federal spending. No question it's gotten out of hand. But remember that most people have already "paid" for those "entitlements," like social security and medicare, with their taxes. The fact that Congress has been robbing those accounts for years to pay for boondoggle pet projects is apparently irrelevant. Now, they want the American people to agree to that theft -- and in fact embrace it.

The reality is, however, there just isn't a lot of alternative discretionary spending available where serious cuts can be quickly made.

The military is already taking a huge hit. Taking more from that budget is unwise. Our infrastructure is in terrible shape and getting worse. Slashing money for roads and bridges will actually hurt the economy by slowing the transport of goods. Recent news stories have shown the value of having health- and product-monitoring agencies.

Looked at piece by piece, there just aren't the needed billions and trillions laying around being wasted in large lump sums that could make quick, serious inroads into spending relief. This is a slower process to do right.

It's going to take a concerted effort by the government agencies themselves to spend no more than is absolutely essential, to literally watch their pennies, nickels and dimes (because they DO add up) and if any budgeted funds don't get spent, they should go directly to debt reduction, not grabbed up by Congress for some quick pork-barrel project (and those have to end as well, period).

It's time Congress and the administration quit playing power games. We thought that, ultimately, was the cry of the last election.

Understand, if any of you Congressional millionaires can, what life is like for the rest of us little guys, and do something to help US. Now!

-- Kelly Everitt

Showing comments in chronological order
[Show most recent comments first]

"At least the current guy in the White House puts the wars and the VA costs for wounded vets in his budgets."

This was my favorite line in this conservitive bashing piece. In 4 years obama hasn't had a budget.....lol

I'm no Bush fan either; I'm a US Constitution fan.

-- Posted by Trouble2011 on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 10:40 AM

Kelly I thought I was the only one to use the word (Dubya) for the past two years, I've been using it but I spell it a little different (Dumya)

Great Blog as always.....

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 11:25 AM

Oh WoW someone has the same point I have over the WMD and I for one never said anything about it on here.

Convoys where spotted crossing the border into Syria before we got into Iraq with the invasion. Nobody had the time knew what was in those trucks and never bothered to find out.

I believe the intel was right and Saddam had the WMD and got them out of the country before we could get to him and his weapons. We found the labs where is was making chemical weapons but not the weapons.

I have been wondering also where did Syria get the chemical weapons. During Desert Storm Saddam flew his aircraft, some at least to Iran and then they wouldn't give any of them back to Iraq. Then went Bush invaded Iraq we found Mig 25's buried out in the sand, now thats something a complete aircraft of that size buried in the sand.

To many people forget that during the Iraq, Iran war we give Saddam weapons and training.

I still believe the WMD were there and went someplace or got buried, Syria looks like a good choice to have got them.

Now we set back and watch to see if Syria is going to use the weapons on their people. Once all the crap is mixed nothing anyone can do but watch what happens and if one of the terror groups should get their hands on them look out nobody is safe.

Guess I got a bit off track but I am just a little more than a bit tried of us taking all the heat and spending our tax dollars on these countries that want to do nothing but kill the people in the west and their own if they get in the way. If they want to keep killing each other off let them have at it and we stay home and mind out own business and that our tax dollars stay here also.

-- Posted by Eagle_eye on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 6:00 PM

We keep voting in people who don't get the job done. As long as people repeat their mistakes, we have no one else to blame but ourselves, the voter.

If these guys were building our house, we would have fired them a long time ago. But no, we keep buying into the political lies that EACH party gives us.

This is not conservative versus liberal or even Republican versus, Democrat. But a great malaise of the American people failing to save their own fiscal livelihoods.

We have allowed idiots to take over our economy, manufacturing and even farming. Now they want to get into the medical sphere too. Throwing our Money to the winds and adding a little spit to throw back into our faces.

It doesn't bother those whose pocketbooks are not affected or those who have ceased to pay their way and their own fair share back on the debt. Why should they care? Either way they are being taken care of by hook or crook.

While all of us have been watching one fox raid the hen house, an entire pack has found a hole in the fence and taken all the chickens out one by one. No one being the wiser because they aren't focusing on the real issues, only trying to identify the single fox that seems to be the decoy for the rest of the gang.

It is disgusting to see what we have done to our country by allowing greed and selfishness to pervade every aspect of our lives. We can't have it all and by the same token, we shouldn't allow the Government and other individuals to have it all either.

As for the wars, our approach was wrong from the very beginning. You cannot wage a war against an entity that has absolutely no value for human life. It is like picking up sand from the beach with a toothpick. What we should have done is continue the shock and awe a little longer than we did. And then presented a valid exit strategy. Instead, we have bumbled along with TWO presidents.

Bush may have made some mistakes, but He never backed down unlike our current president. He didn't leave 4 men unprotected when help could have been given and any time. And most of all, he didn't lie about the entire situation to save an election.

All of Bush's errors were glaringly published on a daily basis. None of Obamas have received the same scrutiny except by one network. We keep giving all of these crooks a pass and we allow the media to tell us what we hear and how to think.

That is my cranky rant for the day.

-- Posted by KH Gal on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 8:51 PM

Let's not forget that this fiscal cliff is the sole creation of the U. S. Senate and their bi-partisan "Gang of Six". Three Democrats and three Republicans (which by the way included our own Sen. Crapo) crafted it and thus have first right of ownership. These same six were part of the total Congress that voted it into law in 2011 and will have to take some action soon if we are to avoid becoming lemmings ourselves.

I for one have no expectation that these six people and the other 529 will do little more than go back to kicking the can down the road.

And while that might be a great pastiime for a bunch of kids on their way home from school, it's for darn sure no way to run a railroad, much less a nation.

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 9:39 PM

I believe the people that have ceased to pay their way are not the elderly on Social Security or the retired military. The people that are not paying their way or pulling their weight.

1. People on welfare

2. People on food stamps (the lady on her new I-phone in front of me using food stamps)

3. People not paying taxes (this would include those people that get all if not more of the money takenfrom their checks at the end of the year.)

4. People that work for cash under the table as not to affect the amount of unemployment (99 weeks) so they only have to work part time and don't have to get a real job. I turned a plumber away even though he was the lowest bid due to this.

These are the people that are the problem, we are almost to the point of more people taking out than putting in. The pot will empty fast and the people putting in will give up and join the ones taking out. I know I'm getting tired of putting in only to have the lady with the new I-phone, junk food, new car, and alcohol only be their to take out.

-- Posted by Trouble2011 on Wed, Dec 5, 2012, at 10:05 PM

Idiots: The ones who fail to get the job done but tell us that they love America and want what is best for us if we will only vote for them. And the people who continue to vote for them.

Foxes robbing the hen house is just what I said. You have one person taking the focus off of the entrance to the hen house and 10 others sneaking into the back door and hauling off anything that isn't nailed down. Pretty soon, all you have left are the droppings from the chickens and that is what they offer us ever election.

The 47% in my opinion are not the people on social security or disabled, but those who take advantage of their positions in goverment and other high places to skim not only off of the top, but down to the very bone.

If we cut all of their salaries by 30% and make them pay for their benefits, would we see a change of some sort? Probably not, because they would devise a way to cheat, steal and grab under the guise of "reform".

Budget cuts start from the top down on this fiscal cliff. if you don't need it, we can't afford it.

-- Posted by KH Gal on Thu, Dec 6, 2012, at 8:06 AM

Apparently, you think that I am not all that bright.

Here is my observation and I don't think I can say it more clearly.

Anyone who has been entrusted with the safety, welfare and promotion of liberty to a body of people should honor that trust. This would include all persons who take an oath of office, or sign contracts. Your word should be your bond.

People in this position are amply compensated and should not betray that trust to fill their own pockets or pursue nonsensical and impractical endeavors. Regardless of Party or personal belief.

I am thinking like Buckshot that you are Wayne too. So I will say a friendly hello.

-- Posted by KH Gal on Thu, Dec 6, 2012, at 10:53 AM

Funny my comment was deleted oh well! Just so you know it wasn't anything vulgar Just saying who Wayne is........

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Dec 6, 2012, at 12:01 PM

You have got to be kidding. Immature, childish, pot stirring behavior is ridiculous. Can we please stay on topic. I don't really care who is who. No-one else should either. Take care of your own business and leave it alone for everyone else with the guessing games. Either you choose to have a true name declaring user name or you don't. Pick yours and be done with it.

-- Posted by Brenda Fincher Publisher MHNews on Thu, Dec 6, 2012, at 1:29 PM

Hi Brenda Please when you have the time could you put my email address on my blog. I see some of the other bloggers have a contact address. Mine is Crookmaa@aol.com. Thank you in advance


-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Dec 6, 2012, at 2:45 PM
Brenda Fincher, Bus. Mgr., MHNews
Done! Sent you an email from the link on your blog to make sure it works. B

I have to admit, I just skimmed the blog, didn't agree with the parts I read, and did the same thing with the comments.

You guys know where I stand, as I do you, and there is no sense in argueing over it. But I just wanted to say that I'm all for going over this dumb fiscal cliff (I hate what they're calling it).

I hope we land flat on our face! I hope that America will get a wake up call. Obviously keeping the same people in office and expecting different results isn't working. I'm not talking about Obama, it's all of 'em.

You people want change? Do something different! How can we expect to take in the same amount of money, spend as we always have, and come out ahead just because our candidate won the election? That's just stupidity...

Demand the same responsibility from the people that represent you as you do your own family. If you want a new car, you don't just raise your 'debt ceiling' and go buy one. You cut spending in other places and save until you can afford it. Why should the government be any different?

It's kinda cool talking about it.... We get on our blogs, complain about this and that, insult and put down others about who's right... But who's actually doing something? Who's wrote a Congressman? Who marched on D.C.? Who's actually done anything to protest what we are complaining about?

Here we are, yapping our flaps, while they're spending OUR loot! And then we want to complain about who is more American while we're sitting on our fat as... ahhh nevermind..... Most of you won't stand up for what you believe anyway....

Everyday, I'm going to be posting the name of a Congressman or Senator and their phone number, both Democrat and Republican.

Instead of complaining on the blogs, grow a set and call them up and tell them how you feel.

Let us know how it goes :)

Mike Crapo (haha, sorry I'm childish) 202-224-6142

James Risch 202-224-2752

Raul Labrador 202-225-6611

Mike Simpson 202-225-5531

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 12:31 AM

I agree with everything you have said Bazookaman, but I think you have me mixed up with someone else. I never said that obama was looking out for the military. He is only looking out for himself, he will even throw his allies under the bus if it benifits him and his cause to bankrupt America. Funny thing about the debt ceiling is during his 8 months as a senator he made a speach critizing Bush about wanting to raise the debt ceiling, now he wants king powers to raise it at will.

-- Posted by Trouble2011 on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 7:28 AM

BroncoTommy, your contention re: going over the cliff makes sense. After all, the cliff was carved by Congress. We'll go off the cliff, that which most perceive needs to be done will be done, and red/blue will retain rights to blame blue/red.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 7:28 AM

This is my last post on the entire matter. I make generalizations because unlike some of the posters, I don't want to make everything personal. I don't believe in calling someone a tard or any other name.

I should have said that people were acting like idiots and I apologize. The fact is and remains to be so that this is beyond class warfare, political correctness and other issues, but a spiritual one. The battles that we are facing are much deeper than politics.

The facts don't win any arguments either. We have been witness to that time and time again. You can have every written or known fact in the universe at your disposal, but if you lack common sense about what you hear, see or speak, they are like dust.

My comments are reflective of my writing style, no more or less.

The crux of the matter for the entire nation is that we have stopped being a people who believe in the greater good for all. Instead, we believe that anything goes in society and if you can lie, cheat or steal your way to the top, you are congratulated. If you have some social issue upon your heart, you will appear on Oprah.

None of us have remained untouched by personal tragedy or economic woes. Instead of people just letting you respect you as a person, we legislate for every contigency in order for everyone to be happy at the same time.

However, while this has been going on, No One has been happy. Each accuses each other of racism, phobic mindsets and rigid thinking.

When a person wakes up and realizes that they have lost everything that they hold dear, will it be a home, a business or a loved one? Or even a country?

I know what it is like to start over, to lose everything and make a new life for myself and my children. While the Government may have provided temporary help, it was family and friends who made the real difference. And most of all God, made the ultimate change in my life for the better.

Some things belong in the bedroom and private, other issues need to be discussed with trusted loved ones and most of all, No one should be honored or compensated for bad behavior.

This is my last generalization in my comment here. America has become a daycare center. Who is in charge? We are sure that we don't know because all of the adults are out doing something other than the jobs that they were entrusted to do. The bratty children are bullying the quieter ones. Each child has a label on their back and they are expected to behave exactly as they were assigned.

The entire daycare center is a mess and every day there is fighting and contention. When the adults come back to "check" on the children, they put their best faces on as though everyone has been good.

If you recognize yourself or someone eles in that observation, more power to you.

-- Posted by KH Gal on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 8:04 AM

Just a quick reference to gas prices:



-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 8:30 AM

I agree, Buckshot. I've been calling all morning (aside from when I had to feed the horses) and am only getting answering machines.

I guess we had our chance to let them know how we felt a few Tuesdays ago.

The people have spoken! Over the cliff we go... Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 11:23 AM

I just read this and I thought I'd pass it along......

Democrats are like Christmas lights... They all hang together, half of them don't work, and the ones that do aren't that bright.

Hahaha Sorry about that, I just thought it was funny.

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 11:35 AM

Emanuel Cleaver wants to know how I feel about the current fiscal cliff. He emails me.

There was a place to put other and I voiced my suggestion that they all take a 30% paycut.

I wonder what kind of answer I am going to get back?

-- Posted by KH Gal on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 12:18 PM

Because we are arguing the tired argument of Liberal vs. Conservative, I will attempt to shine a new light.

I find that the most fundamental difference between the two is what they feel about uncertainty and what we should do about? Uncertainty could be about jobs, inflation, the environment, national security, diplomacy, etc. It is simply the acknowledgement that things are not guaranteed to work out as planned.

Take for example, poverty in a given city. There is uncertainty about whether these people are going to rise up or if they can. The liberal wants the government to ease the uncertainty involved. The Conservative acknowledges that uncertainty is part of life and throwing money/time/resources is not going to change it. The uncertainty is going to be there after just like it was before. Therefore, they want those involved to ease their own uncertainty about jobs, quality of life, etc.

Now, just to cut some off at the pass. Think about an issue and drill down below the emotion and rhetoric and think what motivates someone to do something.

As for Obama, his popularity comes from his ability to convince many that he can ease the uncertainty. They believe that they are doing all that they can do and things are not working out. Therefore, they need someone at the top to fix the system and ease the uncertainty.

I voted for Gary Johnson, the Libertarian candidate so certain ones can back off their predisposed ideas. In other words, I do not buy the sales speech of Obama.

I hate to be all conspiracy theory-like but I get this weird feeling that Obama wants to go off the cliff. He wants a disaster so that he can take more misplaced credit for things improving afterwards. As his buddy Rahm Emmanuel says, "Never let a good disaster go to waste".

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 12:56 PM


Ta-Da! happy days straight ahead.........

-- Posted by UM1233 on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 2:21 PM

That's pretty cool, Tommy. I'm glad you got through to them and it's cool that you actually waited. I tried all this morning and just got the machines. I wasn't sure what I was going to say if I did get through but, it was probably just going to be a bunch of complaining. Maybe I would have asked what they have honestly done to justify another term?

After I wrote my comment last night, I got to thinking about it. And I guess it really doesn't matter if we call them or not, does it? I mean, do they really have to listen? Most by now know that they can argue and fight like little school girls and get re-elected so, why would they care about how we felt?

I guess we actually had the chance to make that phone call in November and according to the polls, most of us didn't.

Like Mike said to me this morning... We sent the same team back in for the second half of the game and have the audacity to complain because they still can't score a touchdown.

Good for you on calling though. In a time when it's so much easier to just complain about it on a blog, it's kind of cool to see someone do that. Now if we can just put together our own "million man march", they'd have to listen to us.

P.S. I just saw a picture of Boehner going on another crying jag. Although I do agree with some of what he says. I'd still like to give him a punch in the nose for being a sissy hahahaha.

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 2:44 PM

Tommy, just saw your last comment. Now that is an awesome demand! To ask them why they are always putting military, veterans, and senior's pay on the table instead of their own, would be priceless!!! And to tell them that they instead should take the paycut!!!I would love to hear the studdoring answer they give.... Calling right now!

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 2:59 PM

Office hours are from 9am to 6pm my A....... Well pick up the dang phone!!!!

Thanks, Tommy. Thinking about what you said has made me mad and you sir, have just ruined a perfectly good Friday afternoon for me!!! hahaha :)

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 3:06 PM

Anyone who decides to vote a straight party ticket short-changes themselves. Why? because, we lose the opportunity to bring in new faces and new ideas.

Do I vote Pro-Life? Yes I do. Have I held my nose when the two choices were both stinky? Yes.

Does that answer your question?

-- Posted by KH Gal on Fri, Dec 7, 2012, at 10:24 PM

It won't be long now.

-- Posted by skeeter on Sat, Dec 8, 2012, at 7:08 AM

what would we do if we did not have those few to tell us that everything is going to heck in a handbaskset. And get this... only they can see the writing on the wall.

Forcing Congress to take a paycut sounds good but it is a bit hollow. While I support it, it is really a drop in the bucket. Also, most in Congress became wealthy through other means. This is mostly supplementary income to them.

Cutting off the pension and life-long benefits would make the greatest impact. It would not be felt so much in the short term but give it 20 years and the savings would become very substantial.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Sat, Dec 8, 2012, at 4:22 PM

A lot of what is written about taxes is peppered with hyperbole and exaggeration. However, if you want proof of what high taxation can do just look at California. Being in Reno, we hear all about it. The list of taxes that they impose on individuals and firms is too long to list on here.

There is talk about them tripling the vehicle registration fee. this would result in the average cost of registering a vehicle from $330 to almost $1000.

the result of this steady increase in taxation has been a slow but steady exodus of the middle class. Also, large firms have started to take their operations elsewhere. Some can't do it because of excessive costs but those who can are doing it.

What is to say that this would not happen nationally if the same principles regarding taxation were imposed?

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Sat, Dec 8, 2012, at 5:15 PM


I think I understand MrMister.

Did anyone see Simpson and Bowles this morning on Face The Nation? Good interview. Check out the video on the CBS website. Too bad we don't have more Alan Simpson types to help out.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Sun, Dec 9, 2012, at 11:11 AM

The fiscal cliff is only happening because pride is getting in the way. Republicans do not want to compromise because it will somehow show their lack of solidarity. Democrats do not want to bend because spending cuts would damage their re-election hopes and dent their hero image. Go ahead and heap a bunch of rationalizations on top of this but at the core these are what driving the two parties.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Sun, Dec 9, 2012, at 11:50 AM

Besides all that, our elected leaders do a great job of stirring the pot. They want us all to believe that it is really a matter of one party not cooperating. Supposedly everything would be perfect if not for the (fill in the blanks). Yeah.... good one. They have their own individual agendas as well. They hide behind the party to get credibility but I have a hard time buying into this solidarity line.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Sun, Dec 9, 2012, at 12:18 PM

I'm thinking the legislation that brought us to sequestration is the law we'll be living under in a few weeks.

Sequestration is the bitter pill that many believed Congress and the President didn't have the nerve to ask us to swallow, so they chose an alternative to a pill and gave us a big suppository.

They inserted that Sequestration Suppository when the electorate were all distracted and arguing amongst themselves while trying to dig up the President's Roots.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Sun, Dec 9, 2012, at 10:39 PM


-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Sun, Dec 9, 2012, at 10:55 PM


Again, both sides are at fault. Different motivations drive them of course. If it was up to me (and you, I assume), I would mandate a balanced budget. This budget would have to be done and set in stone by February 1. That would be a start.

After that, i would mandate that the budget decrease by 2 to 3% each year. It matters not how it is done, just that it is done.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Mon, Dec 10, 2012, at 9:19 AM

A long time mentor of mine (at work) once told me that true compromise was a settlement where both sides left the table grumbling about their losses.

Made sense to me then and still rings true to me today.

-- Posted by wh67 on Mon, Dec 10, 2012, at 10:08 AM

On the bright side, a person living in rural Idaho could have no knowledge of the fiscal cliff and probably have their daily lives affected very little. Their ignorance would be a bit of a blessing.

Think of all the pseudo-gossip they would not have to endure. Think of all the high school clique-esque bickering they would not have to sit through. I almost think that getting on these blogs and others is more an indication of my masochism than genuine interest.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Mon, Dec 10, 2012, at 3:49 PM

What is somewhat humorous is that people identify with the party and pretend that they are really a part of it. Those politicians act independently of their constituency. They sell you at election time on them and then hunker down and serve their agendas after that. The average joe who sits at home and identifies themselves as Democrat or Republican operates independently of the actual leaders. It is like sports fans thinking that they actually influence the outcome on draft day or on the field.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Mon, Dec 10, 2012, at 9:45 PM

BroncoTommy, I'm not certain of MrMisters reference to "Dougggy".


Kardashian's kitty died? I hope it didn't drown in the bathtub.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 6:48 AM

Should we cut VA or military retirement benefits to every veteran who was part of any failed military venture our country has undertaken?

If a company had a division that had failed to produce a marketable product, for whatever reason, and all the employees of that division were released, would that company continue to pay those former employees in spite of their failure? How would shareholders benefit by continuing to provide benefits to those former employees?

Anyone see any room for compromise there?

I'm not advocating a position like this, but I wonder if this type of idea is bouncing around the heads of some who would like to see our government run like a business.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 8:25 AM


You know what happens when you assume, you make an A$$ out of u and me.

I am indiscriminate in my thoughts. Everybody, every party is fair game. My main goal is to shine a light on the more complex underpinnings of the issues. Not everything is black and white. Politicians use the complexity to deceive those who can't see through the smoke and mirrors. Politicians of both parties. FYI, I have sung that same tune for the last 4 years.

Back to the topic,

The latest budget issues would be easily solved with a balanced budget amendment. It would not the magical cure-all, by no means. There would still be complaining about where the funds go. However, time has told us that politicians are incapable of managing the nation's finances. A balanced budget amendment would force them to steer the ship in one solid direction instead of everybody having their own agendas and pretending to care.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 9:35 AM


I have beat the dead horse more times than you or I can count but the issue is not revenue but spending. This extends from the feds to the states and counties. Less spending will reap gains that exceed that of increased revenues.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 10:51 AM


I can ramble on at times as well. I try to keep it short. The only problem with that is that some take it upon themselves to "fill in the blanks" and make assumptions. Just because in a specific post, I do not lay out every single position I hold does not mean that I do not have one or that I disagree with the one responding. Sometimes, you have to spell it out for them to not jump to conclusions.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 2:03 PM

Mr Buckshot: I only read posts of a few and it keeps me from getting too upset. Mostly I only read the people that are on the right, but that is just me. Your posts and Mikes are the most informative to me.

-- Posted by skeeter on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 5:40 PM

Think about this one for a second.

I and many others have been preaching for years about spending cuts. This is hardly a new idea. Many other before myself echoed these sentiments. So why do those in Washington never do anything about it? What really keeps them from doing it? Both sides of the aisle have had their time as majority in Congress and yet nothing ever gets done.

If you can, avoid the cliched lines about tax and spend or name calling? I have voiced my theory on this a few times and will spare everyone here the monologue.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Tue, Dec 11, 2012, at 6:02 PM

re: Glenn Harlan Reynolds - Good points on 1 & 2, not sure what #3 is about - maybe he doesn't have a swimming pool or a jet.

re: lapel pin (an issue constipating some minds for nearly 5 years) - I'm less concerned with what you're wearing on your lapel than what's in your heart. You show your patriotism by how you treat your fellow Americans, especially those who serve. And you show your patriotism by being true to your values and ideals. And that's what we have to lead with, our values and ideals.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 1:20 PM

It occured to me that if there is no compromise and we go over the cliff...

The tax structure would revert to the Clinton era levels, which would leave Obama "out of the fray".

It would raise taxes for not only the rich, but the middle class as well, thus providing an equal opportunity for all to provide more revenue for Congress to mis-appropriate and give to those less fortunate.

Finally, it would give the new Congress a chance to establish communications with their constituents after a month or so in office (when those first paychecks start hitting the street).

On a more serious note, I have seen a number of articles in the last couple of days claiming that up to 60% of the revenue that would come from the "tax hike" on the upper 2% may be spent on NEW spending programs while only 40% is going to go toward deficit reduction.

The more things "change", the more they stay the same, except for the change left in our pockets!

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 1:21 PM

wh67 - Yes indeed. The deal's been struck. It was struck back in 2011.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 1:32 PM

I could accept a tax increase so long as there were corresponding cuts in spending. As inefficient at our federal government is, it might take $3 or $4 in spending cuts for every $1 of revenue to truly balance the equation, and I don't see that happening anytime soon.

When I hear seasoned Senators assuring me that we can rebuild America after we leave Afghanistan "because the money is in the budget already...."

Well, livid is a mild word.

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 6:17 PM

I know people who've drawn Social Security without ever having paid a cent toward it. Generally we receive far more than the total of our contributions don't we?

And veterans who were never in peril for any part of their careers enjoy the same benefits as veterans who spent years in the fight.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 7:11 PM

Across the board spending cuts seem highly unlikely, given the power of the special interests in DC. But I like the idea.

The ability to draw more out than paid in was supposed to be a result of interest and growth on the individual's contribution, plus the growth provided by those folks that contributed but never collected.

I can see locking benefits at today's levels for current recipients with vested interests in the plans.

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 7:36 PM

Paying benefits to those who have contributed to the military, social security and medicare is in my estimation an obligation and a responsibility. They are contracts if you will, and must be fulfilled.

If I've done the math right, the tax hike Obama wants on the wealthy will generate about $140 Billion a year. Compared to the $1.1 Trillion deficit we incurred this past fiscal year, spending cuts would need to be around $960 Billion a year to stop the bleeding.

I am sensing that the DC politicos might have figured this out back in 2011, just didn't want us to worry about it during the campaigns.

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 7:54 PM

If your blood pressure is an issue, you might want to pass on this link.


This has a table that provides a look at what will happen to tax rates after January 1 IF the Congress doesn't act.

Note that the report date is in September 2012.

Yes, Kelly, they need to listen, but they also need to come clean!

-- Posted by wh67 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 10:21 PM


Solid posts, keep it up.

Taxes affect everybody in some way. We could go on for years on end about the differing impacts of different taxes. I will make it short. The largest impact of high taxation in the modern era is that it impairs investment in capital. We are moving out of the labor-intensive world and capital (technology, machines, and techniques) is the primary factor in production. Capital is more expensive than labor in the short term. We live in a short term world and so it is not hard to see what the effect would be.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Wed, Dec 12, 2012, at 10:30 PM

I caught the tail end of a news clip this morning that Congressional members have recieved a memo dictatng that they prepare to cut spending by 11% this FY. While I haven't been able to verify it anywhere, (I was about a cup low on coffee when I heard it) that seems to be more evidence that neither Congress nor the White House has any plan to address the looming deadline.

I'll toss this idea out:

Pass another "interim measure" that implements the 11%, across the board spending cut immediately.

OMB will monitor and report spending reductions over a six month period. At the end of the review period, tax rates can be raised by the same percentage as the budget reductions saved.

-- Posted by wh67 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 9:21 AM

The part about the 11% is at the very end of this CBS video.


I was on my tablet when I heard this and found a link to a memo from the White House from early December that looked as if it could be the letter the reporter was talking about. But my tablet won't display pdfs and I haven't been able to find it on my regular computer. And I haven't mastered the tablet history search.

-- Posted by wh67 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 10:08 AM

Re: Not a tax problem but a spending problem; I guess Grover Norquist should ask lawmakers to pledge that they won't support anything money is spent on.

I guess he didn't "get it" either.

But it wouldn't look good if Grover changed horses now.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 11:15 AM

Yes, Americans could afford more taxes. We could do a lot of things if necessity was upon us. However, why choose that route if you do not have to?

The spending problem that virtually every modern day politician has comes from their wanting to be heroes and having no backbone. They value party loyalty and re-election prospects in the short term over long term gains that would benefit everybody.

Yes, the proposed tax increases will not affect everybody equally. So what? The root of it (as someone else pointed out yesterday) is their lack of self-control. Now, this lack of self-control crosses party lines. they both do it.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 11:26 AM

Grover's pledges would be safe, since the tax rates revert to pre-Grover levels. (Great opportunity for those who signed to spin a little PR magic, eh?) And the Dems can pont out that it was more balanced under Clinton's terms and Bush's cuts were just "too much" for the economy to handle.

Obama has no fault, the Congress has no fault, the media would love it, more ammunition for all.

Dontcha just love it when a plan comes together!!!!

-- Posted by wh67 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 11:32 AM

Back in the old college dorm days, we used to have a Friday night poker party once a month. We had one basic rule. Show me the money! If you didn't have the money for the buy in, you didn't get to play.

We tried the credit thing, but there always seemed to be a few that never ponied up.

I guess that's why I think spending cuts need to come before tax changes.

-- Posted by wh67 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 11:38 AM

Twil - I hadn't seen your most recent post, but agree totally.

-- Posted by wh67 on Thu, Dec 13, 2012, at 11:40 AM

Good article here.


-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 14, 2012, at 7:47 AM

There is resentment among the GOP regarding the outcome of the last election.

For those that wish for a few more parties in our system, they'll just have to wait until the GOP fragments and polarizes along a dividing line - compromise. One party based on Tea Party dogma, another party based on Ayn Rand conservatism; although the Ayn Rand conservatives aren't completely embracing the Rand philosophy, particularly in matters of the use of our armed forces and the role religion plays in party politics.

As far as the child of the unwed mother goes, the kid's here through no fault of his/her own. Somebody has to step in to secure the blessings of liberty to him/her.

True story: My wife overheard a couple of elderly women speaking just yesterday.

Elderly woman 1: "That guy just scares the h - e - 'double l' out of me."

Elderly woman 2: "Uh-huh"

Elderly woman 1: "And there's just no way we're going to ever get him out of office. H's going to be there forever."

Elderly woman 2: "Uh-huh"

Elderly woman 1: "And murder isn't right."

Elderly woman 2: "Oh my goodness, no! But I wouldn't be too upset if something happened."

It's a shame that someone, somewhere believes an ignorant, fearful electorate is a valuable asset to any political party.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 14, 2012, at 10:19 AM

Both sides have their outliers. If you'll look closely I did not mention any particular "side" as being ignorant and fearful.

I disagreed with those who called President Bush a Nazi, and I'll disagree with those who contend that President Obama believes being President is not enough for him.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 14, 2012, at 12:19 PM

I agree BroncoTommy.

Theocracy and Objectivism strike me as polar opposites. Not many live at the poles, we're all scattered across the globe.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 14, 2012, at 12:29 PM

saw this on youtube. wonder if this one of the voters Obama should listen to?


-- Posted by skeeter on Sat, Dec 15, 2012, at 10:51 AM

I didn't see the connection to the President either.

Whoever may have failed the "Defendant" in the video failed long before President Obama was elected.

The points that Judge Judy made were right on. I challenge skeeter or bazookaman to provide a link to a video where President Obama would support the sort of behavior the isplayed by the "Defendant ".

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 6:53 AM


Only thing that I will warn you about is the propensity for some on here to "fill in the blanks". Just because you do not elaborate your every position on every issue, they take it upon themselves to fill in the blanks and assume that they know the rest of your story. Strangely enough, they have no evidence to back it up but they sure do stick by their mostly wrong assumptions.

Other than that, conversation on here can be mostly civil. Sticking to the issues and leaving personal stuff out can be a challenge but it usually keeps the blood pressure of all involved down.

-- Posted by twilcox1978 on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 10:05 AM

Instead of complaining about where my tax dollars go. I took 2 full bags of hand knit Children's Hats and mittens up to welfare yesterday and asked them to pass them out to the needy kids of Mtn Home for Christmas. It took me the whole year to make them.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 10:40 AM

Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas!

That is a pretty cool thing to MsM and Mike.

We are "adopting" a couple of people I work with. Because of our hours being cut back at work, there are two families who have had their electricity cut off. We are paying their light bills and buying them a few weeks worth of groceries.

I'd rather do that with my money than have the government send it to build mosques in Iraq.

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 12:26 PM

KT Your pretty cool yourself! I love to hear about people helping people right here at home !

God Bless you and Merry Christmas to you.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 1:33 PM

Thanks Zook. Looks like you are right.

-- Posted by skeeter on Wed, Dec 19, 2012, at 5:13 PM

Something that may be of interest:


-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Thu, Dec 20, 2012, at 6:54 AM

I know Zook, but we have a country that is going in the wrong direction and has been for too long.

The people in the video are never going to vote for a conservative and they are not by themselves. I wish the future would bring some sense of what is right or wrong.

I don't see the work effort by enough people anymore, 99 weeks laying on the couch?

I see clicks of people voting tribally, voting as payback, voting for bennies, voting for one cause and not seeing the country as one last place in the world where corruption is still less than in almost any other county.

I can't blame Obama, he fooled enough people who don't really pay attention and think he is a cult figure. The people in the video is why wwe have Obama.

-- Posted by skeeter on Thu, Dec 20, 2012, at 6:53 PM

Well guys I hate to burst your bubble, but I didn't vote for Obama because I was wanting a hand out. I voted for him because he is honest and is good for our country. He stepped into a mess and I think he has done a good job getting us out of it. Oh and he never did the back flip on every issue like his opponent did. Obviously the majority of country felt the same way.

Mark my words.....after his presidency and years to come he will be noted in history books as one of our remarkable presidents that did good for our country.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Dec 20, 2012, at 11:21 PM

MsM, again, you and I disagree.

Your last post is kind of comical. "honest and good for the country"? Are you serious? How is he honest? Was he honest when he said "abortion will not be publicly funded!" How about when he said that he would cut the defecit in half? Maybe when he said that they never asked for more security in Benghazi? Remember how he said it wasn't going to be politics as usual? He was actual right about that, it's worse. Oh! And rememeber "the most transparent administration ever!" What a crock of .....

And good for our country? HOW??? We are more in debt. 40 cents of every dollar taken in is owed to China. We are more divided than ever. States are wanting to succeed. And none of our reps. can get along.

"He stepped into a mess." Are you freaking kidding me! He asked for the job!

And as far as "getting us out of it", please tell me how that's coming along. You do understand how much we're borrowing, right? You do know that money has to be paid back, right? Just because you raise your 'debt ceiling', doesn't mean you can get whatever you want. Oh, and just because you're in your 70's and won't have to worry about being around to pay it back.... You do know that your grandkids will have higher taxes because of that, right?

And as for your final arguement..... "he will be noted in history books as one of our remarkable presidents that did good for our country."

The only reason he will be noted for anything is because he's black!

If ANYONE puts this piece of crap down, they're a racist. If you say a bad word about the guy, you're a nazi! What newspaper, what journalist, what magazine, what history book would go on record saying that the first black president of the United States turned out to be a piece of crap??? You know how the backlash would be and you know what they would be labeled as. I ain't scared to say it but, a lot of people are! This guy is a piece of shhhhhh, I better hush my mouth :)

-- Posted by KentuckyTransplant on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 1:28 AM

With all due respect MsM no one said you voted for a hand out. What I'm saying there are so many lazy, discontent bums that will never vote for anyone but a democrat. And the people who vote tribally, or because they are union thugs, lawyers, gays, muslims, hollywood scum, illegals,pro abortion, drug addicted, anti-gun, tax raisers, want the rich to pay more, anti-business pukes, all with media support, make it impossible for a good person to be elected.

The only way the president will be considered a good president is if he comes up with a solution for cancer.

He is a race baiting, socialist, who has made most everyone miserable except the free-loaders.

-- Posted by skeeter on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 6:49 AM

I agree MsMarylin.

Our assessment of any President's performance, and whether or not that performance has been fully successful, is strongly influenced by a couple of things. One is the belief that any decision the President makes will have an immediate and direct impact on our lives; the other is the expectation that we will be instantly gratified by any decision the President makes. Our expectations grow exponentially as the digital age advances.

Ronald Reagan is given credit for driving the Soviets out of business; the Soviet way of doing business didn't help advance their theory either. But even President Reagan built on the good and bad decisions that he and Presidents (and General Secretaries) before him had made; he didn't do it all, and we certainly weren't in on every decision those men made. We aren't in on all the decisions that President Obama makes. We just work with information that we're given after the fact. As we have been.

We're too strongly rooted in the here and now.

Time will tell.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 7:26 AM

Time Magazine named Obama as the "Person of the Year" They must not know what their doing after all they named Sara Palin in 2009- 2010

Speaking of Ronald Reagan how come the Repubs are quiet and not proclaiming that he helped Clinton push the Assault ban back in 1994...? He also raised taxes more times then you can shake a stick at!

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 12:10 PM

It's common knowledge MsM that the dims would take ever gun they could and the repubs would not do that.

It's common knowledge the dims would raise taxes every chance they get and the repubs would not.

You seem to have some hang-up with President Reagan as you have brought him up over and over and usually say "your hero". What is your take on how President Reagan did?

-- Posted by skeeter on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 1:35 PM

I have mentioned Reagan 2 times recently and I did because I wanted to know how you feel about Reagan being a Republican President who was for the gun ban back in 1994. I call him a hero because that's what the Republican Party were making him out to be in Romney's Campaign. I didn't see them bringing out any other Presidents name as much as they did Reagan...

Skeeter it is also a known fact that Reagan raised taxes in 1982-1984-1985-1986-1987.

I liked Reagan I even voted for him both times.

I like Obama and voted for him both times.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 3:57 PM


I was disappointed over Iran-Contra as I was over Fast & Furious.

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 6:09 PM

Arms transfers that go around the law is arms transfers that go around the law.

No two incidents will ever be the same.

How many people do you reckon were killed with the Hawks & TOW missiles we gave those "moderates" in Iran?

-- Posted by Dave Thompson on Fri, Dec 21, 2012, at 8:31 PM

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