Congress may actually pass an economic stimulus bill this week, which is good news for the short-term needs of the country. There is no question the economy is tottering, and could easily tip over from recession to depression, so a bill that focuses on saving jobs and creating jobs is desperately needed. The good news is that the bill will definitely help achieve some of those aims. The bad news is that it will lay a crushing debt burden on taxpayers for the future, which can only be addressed if government becomes far more efficient in the use of tax dollars than it has in the past. That could very well force, down the road, what many of us have wanted for years, a smaller, more efficient government. But somehow, that doesn't seem likely. Because Congress hasn't figured out that the model for government is, and should be, changing. And the best example is the stimulus package. Despite billions of dollars in cuts, it still contains way too much pork. And some of the cuts (to make way for that pork) seem to make no sense, such as dropping $40 billion to help keep schools from having to fire teachers. That's counter-productive. The bill is supposed to save or create jobs, not leave them threatened. Both sides of the aisle bear the blame. The Democratic leadership rolled over on way too many pet projects among its members, losing sight of the long-term goal of the bill. And Republicans kept insisting on sticking to the same failed policies of the past, and playing the same old games where personal and party political power carried more weight than the needs of the nation. One GOP leader actually admitted his goal for the bill, and the amendments he introduced, were designed to divide the Democrats and make them look bad. So much for caring about the people of this country. Both parties should be ashamed. It is time for Congress to look up from its myopic and petty party power games, and its proclivity for pork, and look at the desperate state of the nation, focusing solely on programs that stand a good chance of meeting the goal of keeping people working. Making things work should be a bipartisan issue. This bill should be about America, not the Republican or Democratic parties. -- Kelly Everitt

Now the real budget battle looms

Posted Wednesday, April 13, 2011, at 8:55 AM

If you thought the battle over the current budget -- in which the government came within an hour of shutting down last week -- was a mess, wait until you see the battle over raising the federal debt ceiling.

On or about May 16, the government will hit the current cap of $14 trillion in debt. Although the ceiling has been raised repeatedly for decades, with only lip service paid to "viewing with alarm" the increase, this time it's going to be a real donnybrook.

Don't get us wrong. We fully expect the ceiling will be raised. The alternative is for the federal government to default on its debts, which would be an economic disaster not just for the United States, but the entire world (and don't expect all those nations whose debts we "forgave" following WWII to come through on our behalf when we need it).

Until about ten years ago, the federal debt was manageable, although still larger than anyone liked, and the train wreck of entitlement programs like Social Security and Medicare were looming on the horizon with the baby boomer generation getting ready to enter the ranks of retirees.

But it really started to get out of control during the Bush administration when Bush launched two wars -- in Afghanistan in direct response to the 9/11 attacks, and in Iraq for reasons that still passeth all understanding. Besides the direct costs of the wars themselves, an estimated $4 trillion dollars will be spent on health care alone for disabled veterans of those wars.

Then the economic meltdown at the end of the Bush and start of the Obama administrations added several trillion more dollars to the debt.

Raising the debt ceiling is necessary, but it won't come without a price this time. Most Republicans and even a few Democrats are going to demand further cuts in the federal budget and in federal programs before they agree to it. This is going to get messy, fast.

If the government is really serious about getting its financial affairs in order, it should take the radical step of eliminating all tax breaks and subsidies -- across the board. It's insane, for example, that taxpayers subsidize oil companies, which then pay virtually no taxes, so we can pay $5 for a gallon of gasoline while they reap record profits. It's insane that the richest people in American rarely pay any taxes at all, because of all the tax shelters provided for them, while the average blue collar worker and Main Street businessman is crushed by them.

Shutting down the federal government is one thing. Going in default on the nation's debts is something far, far worse. If you thought they put guns to each other's heads as the shutdown loomed, now they'll be aiming cannon. And this time, the deadline is real. It can't be extended "temporarily."

The battle for the very soul of what the federal government can and should do is about to begin, and a final decision must be made in just a few weeks. Talk about crunch time. The next few weeks may very well determine the future of America.

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No matter where the cuts are to be made.... its going to pinch us all in our pocketbook

Company's move to other Country's because workers there don't get the wages that they have to pay here.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Apr 13, 2011, at 12:51 PM
I was just sayin not wanting to debate with you because you wouldn't agree with me any ways.

I was speaking in general of why company's move and pointing out another reason why they move. hmmmmm did we forget about India, or China ?

Another question why do we have Social Security, and why was it put in place?

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Apr 13, 2011, at 2:01 PM
I saw Obama's speech today, didn't do much for spending and his so called plan is over 12 years, but anyway this pretty much sums up what he did or didn't say. Still on the campaign trail and now getting ready for 2012 run.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_obama_budget;_ylt=Aoxbbq9G7rCV8Ub3Ij1kx2Ws0NUE;_yl...

-- Posted by Eagle_eye on Wed, Apr 13, 2011, at 8:01 PM
I got this in my email today... I copied and pasted as I didn't know how to put a link in from an email

Here it is:

Enjoy this should keep you talkin for a long time....

The President's speech today began a new conversation in Washington about how to reduce the deficit while protecting crucial investments in our country's future.

But as we seek to build an organization based outside of Washington, President Obama's speech also provides an unusually stark contrast -- one all of us can use to start conversations with our friends and neighbors about what's at stake in this election.

He spoke about things you don't generally hear in Washington conversations too often dominated by special interests: He'll cut waste and excess at the Pentagon -- particularly spending that is requested not by our military, but by politicians and corporate interests.

He'll eliminate tax cuts for Americans in the highest tax brackets who don't need them, including himself -- and he will reform the individual tax code so that it's fair and simple and so that the amount of taxes you pay isn't determined by what kind of accountant you can afford.

Some cuts he proposed are tough. But they're also smart and surgical -- helping us balance our books while still doing the right things to win the future. President Obama's plan would protect the middle class, invest in our kids' education, and make sure we don't protect the wealthiest Americans from the costs of reform at the expense of the most vulnerable.

The other side has presented a very clear alternative: End Medicare as we know it, privatizing the program that millions of seniors rely on for health care. Make deep cuts to education. Slash investments in clean energy and infrastructure. All to pay for tax cuts for people making over $250,000 a year, and all while actually raising our national debt.

In short, their plan will please a special interest donor base and those who put ideology before results rather than reduce deficits over the long term. And let's be clear: They think they can get away with it because, fundamentally, they don't think you'll do anything about it.

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Wed, Apr 13, 2011, at 8:24 PM
Careful bazookaman. They are "undocumented workers", and drug dealers are "unlicensed physicians".

-- Posted by VicVega on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 7:41 AM
Watch what Biden is doing during Obama's speech yetersday.

http://news.yahoo.com/video/us-15749625/24896982#video=24902347

-- Posted by Eagle_eye on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 8:17 AM
Ha Ha Joe I seen that on TV yesterday that's the funniest thing I have seen in a long time. Politicians can be funny.

There's another page to the email I got yesterday, didn't give you the whole thing because it was so long...... I didn't want it to look like I copied and Pasted one of Zook's comments... HA ! Just kidding ya Zook ...

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 8:48 AM
IT would be nice if we could discuss without the rants all the time.SORRY IT IS THE SAME RANT .THE FINGER POINTING IS UNREAL AND NO I DID NOT LIKE THE PRESIDENT GOING THERE EITHER.The budget and the money has been sky rocketing for years,i dont see how we can not count the wars in it.Military spending on equipment that was earmarks for political reasons rather than what we asked for.I think the enviromentalist have had to much unfretted say,and the idea that we can just drill all over the place is nonsesense.So lets back up and take a look before we scream.The illegal thing has been beat to death we know the solution,and funny you dont hear the right beating that drum to loudly.they want that vote ,and by the way you cant be illegal and vote.at least you shouldnt be able to.CONTRARY to popular belief the people who are here legally dont want illegals either.

SOMONE said here a poor man never gave them a job .that may be true however a rich man who plays the system and pay no taxes makes a poor man out of the country.Taxe rates for corporations may be to high as they are written ,but the write offs negate that,go online and see who paid and who didnt it will surprise you.The taxe laws are writtrn for everyone so i suggest that instead of filing short forms you file long and that you dont do it yourself get and accountant and discuss what you can do to drop your taxe bite ,it can be done with planning.I pay 300.00 a year to get back 99% of what is taken from my checks .is it worth it ? to me yes.

i would like to see a lot of the subsidies to go away why do we pay farmers not to farm?????? I WOULD THINK THE ONLY THING THAT DOES IS KEEP THE PRICES UP. I WOULD THINK THAT would be A DRIVER MORE THAN ETHENOL.That is just and example.Cutting education is not going to make us more competitive in the world.PRODUCING more goods in this country will.Maybe if we didnt look DOWN OUR NOSES at people who WORK with there HANDS we could get back to making things.We have a mindset that to be worth anything you have got to be behind a desk......SO NOT TRUE.We need to look at what we have done to be in the situation we are in. It is not all about welfare it is about earmarks etc.Both partys have taken the american public to the bank to often to ensure they stay in power,get re elected etc what happened to COUNTRY FIRST? WE GOT ME FIRST,and thats what got us here.....AND WE ARE GETTING MORE OF THE SAME.......SIZE OF GOV,REDUNDANCY,EARMARKS,FORINGIEN AID,JUST TO NAME A FEW NEED TO BE LOOKED AT HARD....REMOVE REDUNDANCY AND YOU SHRINK GOV BUT SEE SOMEONE IS GOING TO LOOSE A BUILDING IN THERE DISTRICT AND WE CANT HAVE THAT CAN WE........SMILE SEE YA

-- Posted by lamont on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 9:35 AM
You must not have your listening ears on Zook cause I hear them laughing about Joe Biden sleeping during Obama's speech yesterday..... HA !

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 9:55 AM
ZOOK DEAD PEOPLE VOTE IN EVERY ELECTION........we only raise the dickens about it depending on wethere you win or lose......forgien aid will never be eliminated,it can be limited .the help for illegals should be out of the country that is the help we should provide.THAT IS A SORE SPOT WITH ME.....knowing what it took my mothers side of the family to immergrate.Money and lots of it.

All welfare people are not BUMS and a lot of them dont want to be on it,and i will say it again people get trapped in it.....and that has been admitted by the right also......the key is constructivly getting them off,dependency should be temporary,kinda like growing up.

Zook i been saying 2 terms you know that ....yes and go home, not lobbying,and quite looking for perfect people to do the job THERE ARE NONE,,,,,and I TEND TO THINK THE PEOPLE THAT WILL REALLY DO THE JOB ARE NOT PERFECT,THEY HAVE LIVED FOR REAL.

I want them to give GATES what he asks for, i want them to HELP AT HOME FIRST,i want them to stop POLICING the world with MY KIDS,and i want them to get real with our MONEY and stop putting it in THEIR POCKETS and there FRIENDS pockets to get latter. WE CANNOT have 2 groups of people in our country (the haves and have nots) it will pull us apart as it has done to every other major civilization in the world.........im on a tear better go.......... see ya

-- Posted by lamont on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 1:15 PM
There are some on welfare that need to be, but don't make a career of it. There are alot of them that have done just that due to the way they were raised, grow up have more babies and get more money from those that pay the taxes.

All the foreign aid we spend needs to stop, why should we support all those other countries while there dicators get rich off it. We are not in the business of giving aid to every tom, dick and harry just cause they want it. Nobody ever comes to the aid of us no matter what the problem may be, 9/11 is a good example of it loss of 3000 people and not all of them Americans but nobody jumped up and said lets help America and never will happen.

All the illegals coming here need to get the big boot sending them right back where they came from, why should we support the illegals just cause they want to be here and enjoy the freedom and the tax payers money. What about all those people in the US crossing the border everyday into Mexico to work when the wages are supposely so low down there? Why are all those people driving across the border everyday into the States? Its a traffic jamb at the border crossing everyday with the vehicle traffic.

If people from other countries want to come here for the better life and try to make money, do it the right way by the laws we have in play. And while I am it let them learn 'ENGLISH' and respect our flag and country.

Bring the troops home and put them on the border and let them protect the United States and stop the illegals, drug trafficers and the people bringing illegals here. And we don't really have time to listen to the Mexican governement tell us what the law should be to stop the illegals from crossing the border. We can even go on our public lands down by the border for fear of being shot but our government doesn't nothing about it except saying the border is more secure now than its ever been. Ariz has the right idea and all our government wants to do is sue Ariz because the Feds won't enforce the laws on the books.

One more thing the media never put it in their report of Obama's speech but he put Biden in charge to get with the leaders of the House and Senate to work out our spending for the budget but he probably missed cause he was so interested he fell asleep and so did the lady behind him. I have noticed lately everytime Obama get backed into a corner he comes out with the trash of Commander and Chief can't just stand by and let things keep going the way they are, that should come under the President who is a leader, Commander in Chief is for the military not all his others worthless leadership.

-- Posted by Eagle_eye on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 4:07 PM
EAGLE EYE I THINK WE ARE SAYING THE SAME THINGS.......BUT I COULD BE WRONG I HAVE BEEN WRONG BEFORE.......... I WILL NOT CALL ANYONES LEADERSHIP NOT WORTHWHILE SIMPLY BECAUSE THEY HAVE NOT DONE WHAT I WANT. SO I CANT AGREE WITH THAT..........AND HE HAS NOT DONE WHAT I WANTED OR EXPECTED......SO LETS BE CLEAR ABOUT THAT........OVERALL I HAVE PROBLEMS WITH WHAT HAS TRANSPIRED......BUT THAT'S ME............

-- Posted by lamont on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 5:06 PM
And it doesn't take a Rocket Scientist to know why the balance is that way ! Rock On !

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 5:48 PM
Cut it ALL! If you look to the folks at this paper or in DC for answers...then we are really up the creek.

Cut-cut-cut and then cut some more. Really tough times ahead that will make today and the last two years look like a cake walk.

-- Posted by OpinionMissy on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 8:50 PM
The reason its a lopsided balance is because the Private sector had a big decrease in jobs since 2008 due to business closures and layoffs.

However the private sector had 222,000 workers in February find jobs, and The Department of Labor announced that the economy added 216,000 jobs and the unemployment rate fell to 8.8 percent in March

The public sector will start loosing thousands of jobs due to state budgets very soon, especially when it comes to Education and fewer teachers. Wait till all the cuts start taking effect

It's going to be some balancing act!

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 9:06 PM
i LIKE THAT EXCEPT FOR BIDEN.......i think he is at a point were its past his bed time if you catch nmy drift (laugh).I hear you,I AM SAYING THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEN NEED AND GREED,THOSE PROFESSIONAL WELFARE PEOPLE AND OUR PROFESSIONAL POLOTICIANS HAVE A LOT IN COMMON.

Part of the problem is they make the rules,and they dont care about our consent.See they have learned how to WORK THE SYSTEM,AND HAVE MADE IT A WAY OF LIFE.

I TOLD YOU I WANTED TO CASH IN MY IRAQ CHIP BUT FOUND OUT IT WAS COUNTERFITE,SO MUCH FOR FREE OIL.

THIS has been a bad week for me the not going to pay the troops thing is still stuck in my head and i cant shake it loose,i am really angry about it.THERE CHECKS WERE NOT GOING TO STOP BUT THE TROOPS WERE I CANT PUT THAT AWAY.

I AM BIG TIME INTO COUNTRY FIRST.WE CAN TALK ABOUT HER WE EARNED THAT RIGHT BUT DONT YOU DARE SHES MINE.i HAVE GOTTEN MYSELF IN SOME JAMS WITH THAT ATTITUDE (LAUGH) YOU know ZOOK there was a time when things were simple or so we thought, they will not be again.anyhow most of us here are saying pretty much the ame things about the weeks events.So i guess some progress is being made.........gotta go

-- Posted by lamont on Thu, Apr 14, 2011, at 10:10 PM
I guess we will agree to disagree, but there is no way I will believe that it was all Obama's fault when there were so many businesses shutting their doors and huge lay offs all because of him.

Your saying when the economy started to fall,(2007-2008) banks closed,the auto industry went belly up that was all on him. Were still trying to recover from that one. AND there is NO way I will agree that these closures were because of being taxed way to much... There's a lot more to it than what you want to believe !!

Here's an updated list of what has been closed.

http://www.thetruthaboutmortgage.com/a-list-of-recent-mortgage-closures-mergers-...

-- Posted by MsMarylin on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 8:52 AM
MsM, Actually Bush sold the county down the tubes also but the Dems had COMPLETE control of both the Senate and Congress in 2006. So spending was going up as well as taxes and Bush went along with it, even if he would have used his VETO they had the numbers to override it so he went with it. We do need to hold these executives responsible and take away every golden parachute out there; just like the politicians they get rewarded for being inept.

-- Posted by Trouble2011 on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 10:39 AM
THERE is no magic wand that was going to bring the economy back in 2 yrs or 4 for that matter.We needed are scapgoat and THE presedent is available.I SEE BUSINESS AS YES TRYING TO KEEP THERE BOTTOM LINES THE SAME,like everything else times have changed,techniques,markets,economys etc there seems to be and unwillignes to changed on there part also.IT has become easier to move than change your business model,so the move is the new business model.YOU can expand based on projections however if the bill is already to high and you have to pay it you cut cost and maintain paying the bill.We scream about what the congress has done and business is doing the same thing, the very same thing.

NOW I DONT CARE THAT THEY ARE TRYING TO MAKE MONEY,THATS WHAT THEY SHOULD DO BUT TO IMPLY THAT THE ONLY THING WE SHOULD CARE ABOUT IS MAKING MONEY IS NOT THE WAY TO GO FOR A SOCIETY TO THRIVE.we need a balance and we have tipped that balance.I dont know anyone who wants to be poor. FOR SOME it is due to there choices how ever I do know people who are poor who have worked ALL THERE LIVES AND WORKED HARD AND THEY ARE STILL POOR.Does that make them less than????? I THINK NOT.IS the major hangup that we give something away or is that a convience not to look at the whole problem?? ItS like saying there is only one group on welfare,so not true,but you would think so based on the media .IT is easy to forget what wages are versus the cost of living,factore in median education levels versus demand and you start to see other things.IN THE MILITARY THERE was a little known program called project one thousand implemented to get low SKILLED jobs filled because we couldnt get what we needed at the time.IT TURNED OUT LATTER TO BE A NIGHTMARE.WE HAD NOT LOOKED AT THE LONG TERM.WE NEED TO DO THAT NOW THE LONG TERM.Does it hurt right now ??????YES. but it needs to be done.

Most short term panic fixes will hurt the country in the long run. YES i have a big stake in it US FROM NAMM WERE LIED TO ABOUT OUR BENIFIETS TO WEAR THE UNIFORM AND RISK OUR LIVES WE ARE FEELING THAT TODAY(THOSE OF US STILL ALIVE) I DONT WANT TO BE LIED TO AGAIN (SOCIAL SECURITY)WE BASED OUR LIVES ON IT.SO if you want to have instant poor people take it from us and you will have........well thats my take on some of this........NOBODY IS GIVING ME ANYTHONG AND NEVER HAS. .....SEE YA

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 11:18 AM
U.S. corporations move offshore to save in wages and taxes. It's nothing new or surprising. Some move their headquarters from one state to another because some states' tax structure favors businesses or types of businesses over other states. Businesses are in business to make money. Regulations, unions, taxes are just some of the reasons behind corporate moves. The only thing they all have in common is the moves are intended to improve the bottom line.

I started working full time when I was 15. Even then I knew enough about Social Security to know what it's about and not to expect it to be around when I hit retirement age. Why anyone would plan their life around a subsidized way of living is beyond me. Sadly we've become a nanny state and there are far too many working the system from one angle or another and/or just waiting for their turn at the trough.

Are there legitimate recipients of aid? Yes. But for every legitimate case there are probably at least as many illegitimate cases. I do believe the assistance programs should be stop gap solutions with results oriented direction that focuses on self sustaining effort by the recipients where at all possible. Those who abuse assistance programs like Welfare make it more difficult for those truly in need to get the assistance they require. Without restrictions like drug testing, required number of hours worked (or job seeking), fraud and abuse will continue with the oversight of enablers.

-- Posted by VicVega on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 3:24 PM
YES THERE ARE FOOLISH PEOPLE OUT THERE,AND YES SSI SHOULD BE A SUPPLEMENT BUT THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO BASED THERE RETIREMENT ON IT,PROBALLY NOT THE MOST PRUDENT THING TO DO BUT WE HAVE MILLIONS WHO DID.i WOULD HAVE TO DISAGREE WITH YOU MTN HOMMER YOU CAN MAKE ALL THE RIGHT DECISIONS AND STILL BE POOR. WELFARE RECIPIENTS SHOULD BE PUT TO WORK if they are phycically and mentally able NO DIAGREEMENT THERE AND I HAVE STATED THAT TIME AND AGAIN.I WAS TALKING ABOUT A PERCEPTION ONLY.That is perpetuated by the media.

THE fed came into welfare based on the disparity of distribution otherwise they wouldnt be in it and they shouldnt be in it .The states should be basing welfare on documented need and not anything else,elgibilty to include above all citizenship.THE SAME HOLDS TRUE FOR EDUCATION.IF IT HAD BEEN DONE RIGHT THE FED WOULD NOT BE IN IT.THAT IS NOT TO SAY THE FED DOES IT RIGHT.

AS far as abusing the system goes that is a two way street.thats why the beauracracy....the watcher to watch the watcher etc.personal knowledge ,feelings,preference etc should not be a consideration .

There is a solution for welfare but nobody wants to tackle it. Any of us on this blog could solve it.I have a solution and i have talked about it to the state and they chickened out i guess you have to be a polotician otherwise they ignore,would cut the cost 1/2 like right now.not everybody on welfare wants to be there.

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 3:42 PM
I MUST RESTATE THIS ANOTHER WAY.......IN MY AGE GROUP PEOPLE WERE LED TO BELIEVE THAT SSI COULD BE A RETIREMENT.....IN OUR NEW AGE OF ENLIGHTENMENT WE KNOW BETTER.THAT DOESNT SOLVE THE PROBLEM FOR THOSE WHO RELIED ON A LIE. I HOPE THAT IS BETTER...........BOTH PARTYS KNOW WHAT THEY DID THAT IS WHY FOR DECADES NOBODY WANTED TO TOUCH IT.......ANY HOW THE AGE WILL BE RAISED THE MONEY WILL BE CUT AND SOME OF US CANT DIE FAST ENOUGH FOR THE SYSTEM.WE KNOW THAT.BUT WE DID PAY INTO IT..........FOR ME. GIVE ME MY MONEY WITH THE INTREST COMPOUNDED AND I WILL GO AWAY,I DONT NEED THEM,I CAN MAKE IT WORK..........HOWS THAT FOR A SOLUTION

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 4:52 PM
lamont man, wouldn't that be great to get that money back? I could deal with that. What's your plan to cut welfare?

-- Posted by VicVega on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 5:33 PM
IT is simple.......If THE MIN COST OF LIVING IS SAY 1250.00 A MONTH . THE COST FOR YOUR FAMILY OF 4. YOU ARE MAKING 1100 A MONTH WELFARE WILL PROVIDE YOU WITH 150.00 AND THATS IS ALL. IN OTHER WORDS YOU MUST WORK AND WE WILL HELP YOU REACH THE MIN SUBSTANCE LEVEL.BUT THERE MUST BE A BASELINE AND YOU MUST WORK.....WE WILL NOT PROVIDE IT ALL SO YOU CAN SIT AND DO NOTHING.

now the system can still be gamed but everything can be.what this provides is a hand up with There help.Imagine how much that would cut like right now.They dont get full unassited handouts ......THEY must work,or be physically and or,mentally unable to to get full unassisted bennys.Then of course you have a system of qualifications and checks through medical and employers.and it becomes a unerversal program so that you cant move state to state to game the system.The things needed to implement are already in place they could do it in 60 days max.

There is not a polotician out there who really wants to see it happen.IT WOULD RAISE TO MANY QUESTIONS AS TO WHAT TOOK THEM SO LONG............ HOWS THAT FOR A CONSIDERED LIBERAL?????????? WHICH IM NOT BUT THATS OK ANY LABEL WILL DO....FOR ANY GIVEN SITUATION

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 7:03 PM
OH AND VIC......THANKS FOR ASKING...........THERE FAULTS IN THIS SIMPLE WAY OF EXPLAINING IT BUT YOU GET THE IDEA

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Apr 15, 2011, at 7:06 PM

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