Little-known law will force many cities to change ordinances

Posted Wednesday, June 8, 2011, at 8:34 AM
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    Thank this so called church, they certainty don't love thy neighbor. This church is indicative of racist victims that believe people owe them. I just hope the cops are out giving tickets to all the jay walkers trying to cross three lanes of traffic instead of walking all the way to the corner to use the crosswalk. Just wait it will take someone getting killed or seriously hurt when they are playing frogger through traffic from the pawn shop to the church of hate.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 1:43 PM
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    There is NO law here about jaywalking, but if you want to do that then you take your life in your own hands. For those that haven't looked there is a cross walk from Alberstons to the so called church but none form Airmens Pawn to Alberstons. Guess have to paint more cross walks so those do goers can use everyone else's parking to get to their so called church. NOthing like crossing 3 lanes of traffic, may as well be like the saying going play in traffic.

    -- Posted by Eagle_eye on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 2:17 PM
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    How about impeding traffic? Public endangerment? There has to be a law for stopping traffic of some sort. The closest crosswalk I have seen is from Albertsons to the strip mall area near Taco Johns, if there was a crosswalk from the Albertsons parking lot to the Salvation Army building it is all worn off and can't imagine it would be that close to the merging of the three traffic lanes. That is trouble waiting to happen.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 3:25 PM
  • "RACIST VICTIMS THAT BELIEVE PEOPLE OWE THEM"............" THE SO CALLED CHURCH"...........IS this the same people who talk about being neigbhorly ??????????? SO WHAT I HEAR IS THE LAW AS SIGHTED THAT WAS INSTITUTED 10 YRS AGO IS AND IMPOSSISION.SHOULD NOT BE ADHERED TO, AND IF IT IS LET US START A CAMPAIGN OF HARASSMENT AT THE VERY LEAST.DID YOU SAY THE SAME THINGS ABOUT CAVALRY?????????? AND IF YOU DID IS THAT AND EXAMPLE OF YOUR BROTHERLY LOVE?????????

    You have got to be kidding me !!!!!!!!!!!! I am going to suggest that both of you go back and read what you have written.Then ask yourself how would I respond to what I have just read???????

    I would like to think that we are better than what I read but Im starting to wonder.Please remember that ANY PLACE CAN BE YOUR CHURCH TO INCLUDE YOUR BACK YARD OR WERE YOU STAND OR SIT AT THIS MOMENT,YOUR GOD HEARS YOU WHEREVER.....THIS IS ALMOST BEYOND BELIEFE !!!!!!!

    -- Posted by lamont on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 3:50 PM
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    Yea that what I said so called church and stand by it. I didn't think there was a cross walk from Albertsons over to that building but there is I drove by there a couple of days ago just to check.

    Lamont, you seem to think only your opinion is the one that counts Got some bad news for ya, everyone has an opinion like it or not.

    Trouble your right there is a cross walk from the Mall behind Alberstons and another behind Alberstons across to Taco Johns. My comment was all sacrasim to start with.

    This outfit wasn't so clear about what they was up to when it all started, now its all out and its going to be a Church and they still have to deal with parking for it by city rules.

    -- Posted by Eagle_eye on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 4:06 PM
  • EAGLE EYE I DONT CARE what you are glouting about..........the so called church has rights just like you, that are governed by laws just like you, so the law has settled the question for the most part.........i wonder what so called church do you attend??????? I WONDER BECAUSE YOU ARE QUICK TO PASS JUDGEMENT AND MOST RELIGIONS TEACH DIFFERENT .....JUST WONDERING?????????? DID YOU INVESTIGATE EVERY CHURCH IN TOWN OR JUST THIS ONE???????????? remember those are questions not opinions.........just wondering ???????????

    -- Posted by lamont on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 8:29 PM
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    Not every church (insert laugh here) sues the citizens of the city they are setting up shop in. On that note I think everyone should start a church.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Wed, Jun 8, 2011, at 10:08 PM
  • this is an excellent summary of this contentious and unnecessary law.

    it gets worse.

    the reason that individuals were sued is that if the city defaults (which appears possible in this case), then the individuals become liable for damages. in any case, the church bringing the suit gets the loser to pay all damages for both sides, but if the church loses, they are not liable for the other parties damages.

    not necessarily a Christian impulse, but an effective tactic to force their way upon others, which is what this is all about.

    there is hope however.

    # 1, I am not convinced from the description of your CUP that it would plainly discriminate, because it does not treat secular comparators better....it simply does not treat secular comparators at all. believe it or not, common sense does prevail in many RLUIPA cases, if you let the arguments play all the way out. what often occurs is that municipalities feel the public pressure and cave, which is of course what the religious activists want. out here in Massachusetts it is the Catholic church, of which I am a member, that has most egregiously pushed RLUIPA to get their way. however, they have lost many of these cases because we have many judges who refuse to knuckle under, and skillful lawyers to argue municipal cases. may your city be so lucky.

    secondly, I recommend that city employees form a book club and get a group discount rate on Professor Marci Hamilton's excellent "God Vs. The Gavel", which dissects RLUIPA to see why and how it and other outrages have popped up in the last ten years or so.

    -- Posted by rmkelly on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 4:45 AM
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    like this town needs another church.

    -- Posted by shockwave on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 6:16 AM
  • I think I read some where that the NLM was already formed and holding meetings at the "Odd Fellows" building. They were wanting a bigger meeting place to hold their services....

    -- Posted by MsMarylin on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 8:12 AM
  • MTN HOMMER POSSES A JUST QUESTION....SO WHO ARE THEY??????????? i can not and will not vouch for them emperically.I will say this it is a christian format,NOW WITH THAT SAID I HAVE TO AGREE THAT USUALLY THESE THINGS CAN BE WORKED OUT TO BOTH PARTY'S SATISFACTION......i said that already,are both sides willing to sit down and talk it out and make commitments that can be kept??? that is the question....or are we going to see who blinks first OR HAVE WE ALREADY WENT 1 STEP TO FAR?????????? I HOPE NOT.

    -- Posted by lamont on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 11:01 AM
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    I can't find "sue thy neighbor" anywhere in my bible. I guess I don't have the new no limit version.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 11:47 AM
  • I cant find a lot of things in my bible especially when it comes to the mistreatment of people,but it seems to get done.

    ZOOK you are right,and that comes from this adversarial society we have today.It encourages litigation,and the poleticians ADVOCATE IT,BUT THERE ALL LAWYERS.

    BACK a comment or two with"the church of hate" that was a very snide remark so let me ask ....WHAT DID YOU CALL THE REV BUTLERS CHURCH??????????? JUST WONDERING.....TROUBLE2011

    -- Posted by lamont on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 1:50 PM
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    I don't recall rev Butler's church suing the citizens of Mountain Home; you can correct me if I'm wrong on that.

    You should maybe open your bible to find mistreatment; the bible is full of stories about mistreatment. Does what the Egyptians did to Moses a nice thing? I don't believe the No Limits was mistreated in anyway. The city was looking out for the safety and health of all citizens of Mountain Home by requiring a plan to fix the toilet and parking issue. The requirements have nothing to do with race, mistreatment, or any other victim's mantra. They claim they are mistreated and use race as a weapon (they brought it up in their lawsuit). Now if that is hate or a way to make a quick buck at your neighbor's expense then nothing is.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 2:08 PM
  • YOU ARNT LOOKING AT THE WHOLE PICTURE.........the communication between the church and the council was flawed .If YOU HAD READ WHAT MT HOMIAN HAD POSTED YOU WOULD HAVE SEEN THAT INSTEAD YOU START WITH THE HATE GARBAGE AND QUICK BUCK ETCthe law stated the race thing and that is that The suit quotes the law.THIS IS NOT ABOUT VICTIMS MANTRA GET OFF IT..........IS THERE A PROBLEM WANTING TO BE TREATED THE SAME AS?????????? WITH THE SAME RESPECT AND DIGNITY OR ARE THEY SOPPOSED TO BE LIED TO AND ACCEPT IT AT FACE VALUE????????I dont think you would like to be lied to would you??? NOW BACK TO THE HATE THING WOULD YOU CALL REV BUTLERS CHURCH A CHURCH OF HATE?????????? ANSWER THE QUESTION

    -- Posted by lamont on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 2:26 PM
  • WOW!that is all I'm gonna say!!

    -- Posted by Brenda M Fincher Publisher MHNews on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 2:52 PM
  • THANkyou HOMMER that is all iv been trying to say .....this is a comedy of errors here, what is so hard about that........none of this should have happened period.......IF anyone thinks I want to see us lose thousands of dollars your wrong. BOth sides could sit down and iron this out.

    There is enough mistakes here to go around.I am as concerned as anyone about what happens in our town.

    CANTJUSTWATCH.....I SAID NOTHING OFFENSIVE....CHASTISE YOUR BUDDY WITH HIS CHURCH OF HATE.....COMMENT.....IF YOU READ ALL MY POST I HAVE CONSISTENTLY SAID THIS DID NOT NEED TO HAPPEN

    AGAIN THANKS HOMMER

    -- Posted by lamont on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 6:37 PM
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    Lamont if they don't drop the law suit even after the city caved then you know it was just for the money and HATE...yes HATE. This church (still laughing about that) must hate the average citizen of Mountain Home. They are not in it for faith they are in for the MONEY.

    -- Posted by Trouble2011 on Thu, Jun 9, 2011, at 10:37 PM
  • FOR ME HATE IS A VERY STRONG WORD AND I STILL CANNOT RECONCILE THAT......ANYHOW ......there is enough blame to go around.I dont know if they will drop the suit but I can tell you this....if its about the money then they have hidden that well........i know a few of these people and that has never once been the stated objective........ill say it again they have spent a lot of time,money and sweat equity.They made attempts to reconcile what they were told needed to be done and that is being done. THERE should have been better knowledge of the building and I think the salvation army knew that ,that is why they did what they did.NOW IF the parking is resolved it is done.

    Im going out on a limb here ....but if the council member with the flippant answers had stopped and thought and not said "JUST GO RENT A PLACE IN STAR DUST PLAZA " we probally would not have gotten here .That is my take.THAT MEMBER AND SUPPORTING CAST WAS OUT OF PLACE AND THAT SET THE BALL ROLLING.tHAT IS NOT THE FIRST TIME THAT PERSON HAS SENT THINGS IN A TIZZY CK IT OUT FOR YOURSELF.

    I dont understand why you have such a problem with this church.Churches such as these are nation wide so what is the beef,your comments and enuendos are demeaning i would no more do what your doing than anything.We HAVE SEVERAL CHURCHES IN TOWN WITH THE SAME BASIC FORMAT I DONT HEAR YOU DEMEANING THEM.Places of worship are places of worship and for me that becomes a hands off situation,i dont have to like them or paricipate it is not for me to judge. That is my faith and it applies for all religions to me because somebody needs what there faith gives them.I have been all around the world AND A FUNNY THING ALL RELIGIONS HAVE ONE THING IN COMMON THEY ALL PRAY TO ONE GOD.DIFFERENT NAMES BUT ONE GOD

    THE DOG TAGS HANGING AROUND MY NECK ALWAYS SAID NO RELIGIOUS PREFERENCE,IF THERE ALL TALKING TO THE SAME THING AND IM GOING TO DIE IT MAKES NO DIFFERENCE WHO YOU CALL THEY WILL HEAR.That is me i dont expect anyone to accept that but it allows me not to judge something im not equiped to judge.HAD a catholic chaplain once in class, a col acknowledge that.

    SO LETS hope they get pass this without a lot of money comming into play because it will not leave a good taste in anyones mouth......

    -- Posted by lamont on Fri, Jun 10, 2011, at 7:16 AM
  • You ever see people try and cross the street over by Kurly's and the flea market corner? That can be a death defying feat. Drivers don't want to bother stopping for pedestrians even if you are ALREADY IN the crosswalk, let alone stop and let you cross with the big flourescent signs stating "yield!!!!" right in front of them.

    -- Posted by UM1233 on Fri, Jun 10, 2011, at 1:11 PM
  • I agree there will be a problem crossing the street but you know it will depend a lot on the time and the day.For me that is a wait and see.

    I DONT THINK THE COMMUNITY ACTED IN A DISCRIMINATORY WAY . I cant say the same for our representatives I should have said that in the singular it would be more appropriate.I think we should remember that the LAW sighted is the attorneys choice before we go pointing fingers.IKNOW IF MY ATTORNEY TOLD ME WE ARE GOING TO USE THIS BECAUSE IT IS OUR BEST CHANCE TO WIN.....THAT IS WHAT IS GOING TO HAPPEN AND I THINK MOST OF US WOULD AGREE.MIND YOU I DID NOT SAY THAT WOULD WIN YOU ANY FRIENDS. MOST LAWSUITES DONT.

    I commented on star dust before. bermensolos heirs could care less that is all im going to say.The church already had a lease in hand,and the project started,you dont just walk away from the money they had alredy spent.So we will all be watching to see what happens..... I sincerly hope that this stops NOW

    -- Posted by lamont on Fri, Jun 10, 2011, at 1:52 PM
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