nationalconversationonrace.com

Mrs. Chavez sounds like an idiot, who is being called an expert because she worked for two idiots.

44-6 and 49-1 but only a plurality, never a majority of votes cast!

If you are talking to me, I have no idiot and I'd like to stay on topic.

Notice sam ran his annoying yap trying to scold Mike for debating the comments of "top" but no response to being caught in his own hypocracy! Seriously sam do you not understand how annoying you are at times?

I'll be happy to answer an on topic question.

CNN published an article called "The New threat: 'Racism without racists'.

It had a few examples of some studies made to show that people saw things differently due to race. The first study had two pictures.

1. Picture 1 had two white men fighting one with a weapon and the other unarmed.

2. Picture 2 had a white man and a black man fighting one with a weapon and the other unarmed.

Then people were asked to recall who had the weapon in picture 1, they were usually correct. When asked to pick the person with the weapon in picture 2, most people (black and white) picked the black man.

The author of the article says that three phrases come up frequently in a discussion of race.

1. I don't see color

2. But I have black friends

3. Who you calling a racist?

The author suggests that when discussing racism, people should first "look within themselves".

http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/ferguson-racism-or-racial-bias/

I've seen those phrases or a variation of them on these blogs. It seems to be a form of denial.

Do you reckon that the Tea Party has Cain and Carson to provide "proof" that the Tea Party isn't racist?

Yes.

YES........

To add to what I said, looking within myself is also something that I should do too. Everybody can do better with self improvement and hopefully have a lifetime of self improvement.

"

The author of the article says that three phrases come up frequently in a discussion of race.

1. I don't see color

2. But I have black friends

3. Who you calling a racist?

The author suggests that when discussing racism, people should first "look within themselves".

http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/26/us/ferguso...

-- Posted by Sam_1776 on Thu, Feb 26, 2015, at 5:38 PM

I've seen those phrases or a variation of them on these blogs. It seems to be a form of denial.

Do you reckon that the Tea Party has Cain and Carson to provide "proof" that the Tea Party isn't racist?

-- Posted by Geordey on Thu, Feb 26, 2015, at 9:12 PM

Yes.

-- Posted by Sam_1776 on Fri, Feb 27, 2015, at 12:02 PM

YES........

-- Posted by lamont on Fri, Feb 27, 2015, at 12:27 PM "

I would assume then that all three of you would agree that a person who repeatedly points out their spouse and family members of the opposite race as proof of their NOT BEING racist is in fact "RACIST"

JUST FOLLOWING YOUR OWN LOGIC THERE FOLKS!

and.......

3..........................

2..........................

1.........................

LET THE SPIN,EXCUSES, AND BACKPEDDLING BEGIN ................................................................................

I AM LOOKING FORWARD TO THE "BUT THAT IS DIFFERENT" ATTEMPTS, THOSE SHOULD BE FUN....

LOL

lamont and Geordie, I cam across an article that I'd like to get your opinion on. It talked about a writer that wanted to write an article that was an "honest conversation about race". Well he made some mistakes on his content, and anger rained down on him. The mayor wanted to investigate him.

The writer of the article that I read says that this frequently happens. An article gets published, people get mad and this "disincentivizes" other writers from trying their hand at such an article.

The article that I read said this.

"That isn't entirely unreasonable. It is fraught like few other subjects in America; the taboo against racism serves us well in most ways; and it ought to be called out in a healthy public discourse.

But if honest interracial dialogue is essential to moving forward as a country, as many Americans believe it to be, it is counterproductive to heap furious scorn on well-meaning people, whatever their race or profession, who try to participate but do so with suboptimal skill or sophistication in a given instance. Honest interracial dialogue cannot exist without speech that is wrongheaded, speech that is prejudicial, even speech that is unwittingly racist. If it were otherwise, there would be no need for the dialogue. The race problem would already have been solved."

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/03/can-an-honest-conversation-a...

It is a touchy subject and I've seen on this blog that there doesn't seem to be a rhyme or reason on what comments will be deleted when the discussion turns to racism. I just watch with interest and scratch my head on the thought pattern going into the axing of comments.

That prevents an honest discussion of race. But then I suppose MHNews does need to not antagonize their customers and I understand that.

That's a good point Geordey.

We need to keep in mind the fact that there are individuals whose livelihoods depend on the business that provides us this opportunity.

SAM......MY experience in the class room says that some people are honestly not aware that there language is insulting, demeaning and racist.There are others that use it as a defense and are quite aware of it's affect.We also noticed that some words had double meanings and did not mean the same to different racial and age groups.This varied, based on age the younger the more knowlegable they were of what was a racist term,the older they were, there was more acceptance that those terms would be used.IT made communications on some subjects touchy to say the least.You get to a place in the classroom setting were you build some group trust and then people would explore the verbage and the why's.AT that point people start communicating semi honestly and that is the best you could usually get in 2 days.Sometimes you didn't get that.The whole things requires tolerance from all involved and hearing what is being said by those involved.

The one thing we almost always got was that everyone had a better incite after it was out in the open.People also seemed to think that if they had more time they would have wanted to explore why certain words set people off both black and white.They also felt they had a better understanding of the other peoples feelings.That was a start, problem is it didn't continue. When it does it is only in select forums TO INCLUDE THIS ONE so the problem continues.

Good points. Lamont in a classroom situation, you can work on the language and try to improve the communication. On an Internet blog, it doesn't seem so easy, considering the points made by Geordey and Dave.

So is it even possible to have an honest discussion of racial inequality on this blog? Keeping in mind that we also have the dynamic that hatred of Obama and liberals seems to disrupt every conversation.

Should I myself try to respond more respectfully to others who are not respecting me in order to focus on the topic? I'm thinking that maybe I should, but I'm also thinking that niceness is seen as a sign of weakness.

SAM.........I have to laugh because both of us at times have attempted to ignore provocation in many forms and sometimes I think that when people hate they are the only ones who change that.If in there cultural environment it is rewarded to call people certain names they will continue that until there are no rewards or the rewards are bigger elsewhere.Labeling is the same way and if they cant get past that you probally wont get honesty because the change means that they lived a lie and nobody wants to feel that hurt.TO say I SPOKE THE TRUTH ABOUT YOUR SONS STOP MEANS THAT YOU HAVE TO ADMITE THAT THERE IS DISCRIMINATION AND PROFILING AND IF YOU DONT BELEIVE THERE IS, THE ONLY OTHER LOGICAL CONCLUSION THAT ALLOWS YOU TO FEEL OK IS THAT I LIED,OR YOU DID.That is a hard one to overcome.Usually by a continuence of the behavior eventually there comes a situation were there communications becomes a liability and they are forced to change.If a person remains in a small and closed environment there communication becomes a liability because it doesnt grow any bigger than the same environment.We found the same applied to discrimination.The officer who stoped your son....his behavior will not change until he changes it,or he pays a penality for it.The dynamics of group behavior plays a big part in that.

It makes no difference how we respond if you are thought of as less than the communication problem remains.By thinking of you as less than it jusities the treatment that is handed out.If I don't see you as and equal I don't treat you that way.When you snap I say see I told you so and I don't have to take real responsibility for my actions.YES it is a viscious circle.You will only remain respectfull to disrespect as long as you need to get your point across after that the communication usually becomes destructive......you are not alone happens to me all the time,my fuse is shorter than yours.Do what you are comfortable with but don't exspect anything in return.......your a great person SAM DONT LET IT GET TO YOU !!!!!!!!THEY CANT BE INCLUSIVE WHEN THEY HATE BECAUSE THEY ARE TO BUSY JUSTIFIENG THAT HATE.ZEALOTRY IS ZEALOTRY NO MATTER WHO AND IT IS USUALLY DISRUCTIVE.......HAVE A GREAT DAY !!!!!! t.

Good advice lamont.

But I consider Junior or Clem to be the donkey. :-)

"The Tea Party members would point to their sprinkling (very light sprinkling) of dark faces iterspersed within their audiences to prove their love and acceptance of darker citizens. I would point to those faces and say spies or perhaps folks who just enjoy watching the comedy of a good dinosaur show. Perhaps a handful of them are there because they are easily persuaded."

THE NAACP MEMBERS WOULD POINT TO THEIR SPRINKLING (VERY LIGHT SPRINKLING) OF LIGHT FACES INTERSPERSED WITHIN THEIR AUDIENCES TO PROVE THEIR LOVE AND ACCEPTANCE OF LIGHTER CITIZENS. I WOULD POINT TO THOSE FACES AND SAY SPIES OR PERHAPS FOLKS WHO JUST ENJOY WATCHING THE COMEDY OF A GOOD DINOSAUR SHOW. PERHAPS A HANDFUL OF THEM ARE THERE BECAUSE THEY ARE EASILY PERSUADED.

Hmmmmm?

AGAIN who is showing their TRUE racist nature?

Klansmen were known for their determination and supporting each other no matter what EVEN when WRONG... Familiar theme here I see.

TRUDY.....MOST OF US HAVE WAY MORE THAN ONE GROUP IN OUR FAMILY'S......When you look past the gate THERE IS A BIG WORLD OUT THERE.MY FAMILY IS SUCH A COLOGE THERE IS NO LABEL..........AND IT WILL ONLY GET BETTER,AND BIGGER !!!!! I have a grandson in bejieng teaching English and he is only 24 so there aint no telling !!!!!!! OUR FAMILY CONVERSATIONS ARE JUST GREAT, A WHOLE LOT OF SHAKING GOING ON !!!!!!!...............LATER

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm!!!!!!!! THE GAMES PEOPLE PLAY.

The article below is an interview with Eric Holder, mostly about Civil Rights. He said that right now the burden of proof on a Civil Rights case, for example Trayvon Martin and Michael Brown, is too high for the Federal Government to feasibly bring the case to trial.

Holder is considering lowering this so that the Federal Government can step in as a "disinterested" party when local and state law enforcement, and prosecutors seem to have way too much interest and pull in not prosecuting someone for a crime that seems to be Civil Rights related.

I thought the article was a good read.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/02/eric-holder-civil-rights-interview-mike-al...

So let's be honest about it then shall we?

You and your "family" of supporters don't actually wish to have an OPEN discussion about race issues and opinions, you wish to have control over a blog site where you take turns agreeing with each other over the same viewpoints and call it an "open discussion"...

IF you truly valued opinions different than those within your tight knit little group you would be able to see the "mirror" being held up right in front of your face each time I showed you how easily the "colors" could be substituted and interchanged.

You ALL have clearly proven that in YOUR opinions that only WHITE FOLKS are racists.

The racist bigoted mentality drips from your words and continual posts attempting to prove otherwise.

I read the article Sam. It looks like Holder is glad to be moving on. I hope that he can make some progress on making it easier to try a civil rights case but that seems to be pretty impossible. His idea of changing the laws to improve the situation seems more practical to me but probably not until after the 2016 election.

Lawyersareleeches if you want to have a conversation I suggest you change your name and start over with a more courteous attitude. Nobody wants to deal with boorish behavior.

SAM,,,GEODRY..... I read it.I think he is tired.I also think that the idea to lower the standard is a bad one.My reason is that DOJ` is the last bastion of help.To be able to give crediable help means that your standards to even investigate are higher than anyone else.That doesn't leave room for question about the results from either party involved.That is my feelings.I think the suggestion is born out of frustration.The Martin case was extremely frustrating Im sure he is still emotional rapped.

GEODRY...You are right the local prosecutor has to much vested he is not going to look at the case the same way.I will say that the ballot box should remedy some of these people people need to remember that.

SAM.......YES good read !!!!!.....LATER

I WOULD SAY THAT MIKE YOU AND LAWYER.........ARE LOOKING FOR A FIGHT ??????? SOMEONE SAID SOMETHING ABOUT THE TEA PARTY?????? I SAW THE NUMBERS IN THE VERY FIRST POST.I have no idea what they stand for or mean enlighten me.I went back and read the post it would seem that the conversation was general except were the question came up about idiots and then suddenly it turned nasty.Are some post missing because the continuity of the conversation is not there.So I think before anyone goes off here maybe and explanation is in order.

LAWYER.....JUST WERE DID YOU GET OFFENDED??? That all of a sudden people became a group to confront and attempt to insult.? IT was there that you were baiting people is that the way you start conversations??? I didn't see were anyone baited you?????? I don't think anyone came to a conclusion that only whites can be racist I didn't see that anywhere either.

Mike I guess you feel the need so I will leave it at that.

LAWYER.... I WILL AGREE WITH GEODRY, YOU WANT TO HAVE A CONVERSATION OK. YOU WANT TO PLAY THIS BOORISH GAME I DONT WANT TO TALK TO YOU.I DONT LIKE BEING RUDE BUT I WILL NOT BE BAITED AND THEN INSULTED, AND YOU HAVE ALREADY CROSSED THOSE LINES.

Hand in hand with racial discrimination is "white privilege." An example of this is when a police officer will give a break to a white person that he or she wouldn't to a black person.

"The Atlantic" had an article discussing a study done in a part of Australia that had a similar history of the South in the United States except that it's struggle was between white people and aborigines.

In the study they had people get on a bus, dressed casually, and say that they didn't have enough change to get to the next stop. If the person getting on the bus was white, the bus driver would more likely let the person ride to their stop.

So then they had the participants change their attire to be either in a nice business suit or a military uniform. Then the aborigines in the study was just as likely to be allowed to ride as the white people that were dressed casually. However, the white people who were dressed in a business suit or military uniform were even more likely to get to ride (90% chance).

So then they tried something else. They had someone conduct a survey. They would show the bus drivers a picture of one of the participants, and ask if the bus drivers would have let the person ride. Knowing that their answer was being recorded, the bus drivers were then more likely to be even handed in their response whether the person was white or black.

The researchers felt that the bus drivers knew that it was wrong to be discriminatory, but only when they knew their response was recorded did they do the right thing.

Maybe somewhere in that technique there is a way to reduce discrimination.

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2015/02/white-privilege-quantified/3...

Well said, Trudy. The videos of police, I believe, is the answer and if a policeman has an incident such as shooting someone and is supposed to be wearing a video camera and doesn't or has it turned off, then we should assume in our courts that the policeman is guilty of wrong doing.

Here is a great Bill Maher discussion on the topic of racism and police.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNIkrsnZ5N0

Oh Trudy I know the simplest approach is to attack the messenger but honestly, how about discussing the SUBSTANCE of my comments please.

See I even used a word I have yet to see others try here. that "P" word. Now let's try it shall we?

I took two different racial statements and exchanged the colors to demonstrate how easily they could be applied in EITHER direction.

Using your "payback" logic should we then go after Islamic people for the centuries of abuse of Christians? Or maybe again using your "payback" logic the Islamic radicals have a right to behave the way they are?

HOW ABOUT WE JUST MOVE FORWARD?

I would suggest if you would like to watch some "videos" watch The First 48 on A&E. It is a fact based drama on MURDERERS in the US and what it takes to catch and convict them. Not fiction but fact. Using the mindset of most of you folks on here the producers of that show MUST be racists because most episodes are about black people killing other black people, not all but the majority so they must be skewing the data to enforce some racist agenda right?

If not I am open to comments, and rational explanations.

Open minded discussion of facts versus fiction... Can that be done here?

Lamont I don't believe it will do any good but I will try. Please explain to me how my changing the words of those statements, changing the COLORS of skin is "baiting" you. Does any one race deserve BETTER treatment under the law than another? It appears according to Trudy that may be her opinion as some sort of "payback"

AGAIN YOU "SAY" YOU WANT OPEN DISCUSSION YET WHEN I SHARE MY OPINIONS AND DIFFERING VIEWPOINTS THE RESPONSE IS EITHER AN ATTEMPT TO EVADE OR FIND ONE REASON OR ANOTHER TO NOT DISCUSS THOSE OPINIONS BY LABELING THEM AS "BAITING" OR "BOORISH"

IS THAT SO HARD TO SEE?

LAWYER......YOU JUST MADE AND ASSUMPTION.......you ASSUMED that the changing of the colors is what I considered to be baiting. It was not as a stand alone.I read it and several other comments placing them all together brought me to the conclusion of baiting.I have seen the reversal ploy before, the problem with it usually is one crucial element is left out... POWER....ONE GROUP HAD THE POWER BASED ON RACE IN PART OF THE SCENERIO AND ONE DIDN'T. I taught this subject and the games used to get it across,from both sides,I can play the klan member very convincingly.My point is what was done doesn't open dialogue, it does start fights.

You are already trying with me ....."lamont I don't believe it will do any good but I will try" ........WITH that statement alone you have put up the barrier you wanted.......what you said in my interpretation is.... your a dumbie but I will try and get through to you....that speaks to mutual respect..I DONT KNOW YOUR HANDLE AND YOUR DISRESPECTING ME?? .....I DIDNT DISRESPECT YOU, I DONT KNOW YOU......why would I discuss anything with you after that???? I can't speak to your intent ,but so far I would not consider it HONEST OR SOMETHING THAT I WANT TO BE PART OF. I DONT WANT TO HEAR WHAT YOU HAVE TO SAY I HAVE PROBALLY HEARD IT ALL BEFORE !!!!!!

Can't refute the message attack the messenger...

Old playbook your working from Lamont...

Try something new for once...

I cannot derive your message lawyersareleeches. Your argument certainly has a right to be considered, however, speaking for myself, I find your submissions disruptive.

Honesty is good Dave, thank you.

and disruptions are needed when the same old discussions have been had over and over again with NO CHANGE...

When those "disruptions" are counter to the opinions held by so many they tend to provoke more emotions and with any luck MORE OPEN AND HONEST discussions instead of the same old routine of attacking the messenger when their message is different than your own.

DAVE......TAKE A LOOK AT LAL 5 TH paragraph starting with..... I would suggest

I read those comments lamont. I really don't know what to say.

I'll clarify. I don't know what to say because it appears the paragraph is not relevant to the point of my article. Perhaps lawyersareleeches could clarify her remarks.

Here's a link to a huff post article that expands on a point I made in my article, supported by Aleman's study.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/1826113

Dave, thanks for the link expanding this to other forms of inequality too.

Yes, Trudy there was a shooting after the Michael Brown incident when the police were supposed to be wearing body cameras. The videos were from surveillance cameras and you can't tell from them if the suspect was pointing his finger or a gun at the policeman. The policeman and his department should have been held accountable for that body camera not being a priority, and being on the policeman and turned on.

"The officer who shot the suspect was assigned a body camera at roll call at the start of his shift, but it was handed to him later in his shift, Belmar said. He didn't put it on immediately and was not wearing it at the time of the shooting.

The police vehicle was equipped with a dashboard camera, but authorities are unsure whether it was activated. Those cameras typically are activated if the officer's lights atop the vehicle are switched on."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/12/24/man-shot-killed-berkeley/20...

You are right Dave the comments are taking on a direction of another road that is for sure. I do believe the story had moved passed its intended banter and discussion.

DAVE.......I went back and read your entire post.Is this your review of ms Chavez's work???

I thought that the message of the post was in this paragraph.

"I believe our national conversation should focus on our national recovery from centuries of cruelly rationalized and cruelly inequitable treatment of Americans, by Americans. The Library of Congress retains much of the material required to rebut and negate the deceptive arguments of accomplished commentators and celebrity historians. We should not waste our national energy through attempts to reconcile our history to denials rooted in dogmatic sentimentalism."

Then Dave does a review of Chavez's comments which appear to be "denials rooted in dogmatic sentimentalism."

So, I felt that the topic was racial inequality still exists and ways to try to change this. -- Was I wrong?

lamont, I'm not critical of Mrs. Chavez's lifes work. I wrote of the impression her article left with me. I thought I had provided a link to the opinion piece she wrote for "Commentary" magazine, but I just noticed the link wasn't uploaded.

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/article/let-us-by-all-means-have-an-honest-co...

If you hadn't asked, I may not have noticed that the link doesn't appear.

Thanks.

THANKS....DAVE .......THAT'S WHAT I GOT OUT OF IT THAT IS WHY I ASKED,NO PROBLEM..

I'm confused. The title of the blog seems to be to talk about race and that seems to be whether race is an issue or isn't.

Now are we to just be discussing Ms Chavez's writing and whether her opinions are good or bad? Just a suggestion but maybe there could be a cheat sheet telling us what is allowed or not allowed in the discussion.

It is frustrating to have to play a guessing game on what is on topic or not? I don't mean that disrespectfully to Dave but a little hint was maybe in order here. It is great that Mountain Home News has these blogs that we can comment on but I don't feel that respect is being shown to the people commenting on the blog.

Yes there are a couple of people that are disruptive but most are trying to stay on topic.

GEORDEY.....I HAVNT DONE IT YET BUT I BELIEVE WE NEED TO READ THE ARTICLE.oN THE BASIC PREMISE YOU BRING UP I have and answer, but I also want to see what this researcher has to say.

I had a very good conversation with a very conservative friend, seems like we were saying the same thing but our language was different.Biggest point from his idealogy was the anger he felt that the entire system was rigged to deny people the American dream and then blame them for not achieving it.The point he was at was that both party's were guilty of it. It was a 3 hr long talk.We mainly talked about this subject from and education stand point. WELL I got to run it's late

I, myself, would like to know what the topic of this blog is.

The points are, to advance the "national discussion", we've got to 1) present opportunities for individuals to respectfully discuss the effect their race has had on their "American Experience", I was disappointed that nationalconversationonrace.com wasn't effectively advancing the discussion, but I suppose there may be some reluctance to mediate a conversation the world would be participating in. A conversation that will end up off track.

2) recognize that discussions on race don't have to be presented as "This is a discussion on race..." The students in professor Aleman's study had an opportunity to subtly advance the discussion, but missed out on it because they were too focused on their own culture.

3) neither should individuals attempt to minimize the impact that racial life events have had on individuals like Jeremiah Wright. Chavez notes we have a black president, however, at the same time she seems to be sending a message that whites are now at risk. She provides a quote from Sniderman and Piazza's book where they say "what encourages blacks to believe that others are prejudiced against them is their being prejudiced against others." Out of the entire book, that's what she felt was worth passing on to us? We could substitute other races within that quote and be as likely to be accurate as Sniderman and Piazza.

DAVE.....ONE OF THE THINGS that me and my friend touched on was the fact that there IS a group of people who want to prove that there is no discrimination based on the fact that we have a black president.Personally I feel that is a cover to attempt to sweep events under the table.Having the grans that I HAVE THEY ARE OLD ENOUGH NOW TO NOTICE THE SUBTLE DIFFERENCES OF TREATMENT THEY GET IN PUBLIC.I might add that there exsperinces are from east to west north to south.What they discuss is how they are treated on campus vs off and the campuses they are on ,very enlightnening.

To me there is also a group who wants to say grin and bear it, don't say anything and it will stop.I say that IF you don't say anything it encourages them to get bolder and continue.

On the education side my friend gets upset with how education is handled in terms of stressing the importants of it. We discussed at length that if the children don't see a reward they don't strive to succeed and that speaks to what they see at home.When a parent no matter how hard they struggle cannot show a positive model the child tends to follow what they perceive as positive feed back wether it's money or just belonging.We talked at length about the model were the parent goes to college but can only get a job as a janitor,the subtle message there is why go to college I can make more money doing this.They have to have that positive feedback and they have to be pushed to feel they will not fail.The 2 schools I HAVE TALKD ABOUT IN HARLEM n.y. They push that and get the results we are looking for.They are the exception not the rule.

I HAVE GOT TO RUN GOT SOME THINGS I HAVE TO DO CK YOU LATER !!!!!!!

The video is hard to read but from what I read, it appears the police perceived the 12-year old boy to be older and bigger than he was.

Part of this could be because of the communication in reporting the incident to 911, and then 911's relaying it to the police in the police car.

Part of this could be that the police may see a black person as more threatening and therefore older and bigger than he is. In their initial report they did describe him as older and bigger than he was even though he was laying right in front of them. That perception needs to change, but how to change it is hard to say. It is IMO a shared responsibility.

My answer was intended to stay on topic.

TRUDY......In reading your post you sound like a police officer of some sort.That's good WE CAN USE YOUR EXPERT OPINION. The questions you raise have been raised and in my opinion alibied away.The crime here that has been compounded is the city of Cleveland is trying to say the child was responsible for his own death,i am trying to wrap my head around that.Your question about race in my opinion is a valid one.

Sam if you ever saw a police report written in some caeses describing a black you would say who are they talking about.WHEN I went after the dept here the report the guy wrote who shoved me was so racist that the capt who came to talk to me admitted that the report was not in there best interest.You would have thought I was a giant CERTAINLY NOT OF AVERAGE HEIGHT AND STATUR.I KNEW THE CAPT AND HE DIDNT THINK IT WAS FUNNY AT ALL.That is also the way call ins come in and the responders come with the idea that there is a major problem.That is what that state trooper did here on 84 that is why the state is being sued.The guy was lucky he didn't get killed.Yes these incidents were recent in the last 3 yrs ....well TRUDY..SAM...... ENOUGH FOR RIGHT THIS MINUTE..........

TRUDY........THE MOST VISCOUSE KIND OF RACISM IS WHEN IT IS INSTATUTIONALIZED.The problem in MO is bigger than ferguson the numbers that the Justice DEPT covered were already known TO SOMEONE they had to be.Therfore someone over the dept knew or at least had indicators of what was happening,plus they had complaints.Someone with power said or at least implied ....I GOT YOUR BACK.......OTHERWISE IT COULD HAVE NOT BEEN AS ENTRENCHED. IF you look at it in a broader sense officer Wilson got set up to do what he did.I did quite a few investigations on cases like this.The tide always rises.

In the Cleveland case that officer would have killed sooner or later he was scared and should never been allowed to handle a firarm..I would almost bet he felt obligated to be a policeman because his father had been one.Shame he obviously was not suited for it and the 12 yr might still be alive.I agree Trudy he came for a confrontation just the way they pulled up.He called in that the 12 yr old was a 20 yr old and that speaks to the discription garbage we talked about,i don't don't know very many 12 yr olds that look 20.especially laying on the ground shot..........got to go later

No, not snarky. I did want you to know that I didn't feel that I could comment on the police errors other than the ones that seemed to apply to the topic of the blog.

I think that's true.

These are the Department of Justice's changes for Ferguson to make.

"Among the recommendations, Holder continued, are the implementation of a "robust system of true community policing"; a review and analysis of the Ferguson police department's stop, search, ticketing and arrest practices; more civilian involvement in law-enforcement's decision-making; as well as new ways to more effectively respond to claims of officer misconduct.

The report also suggests changes to the municipal court system, which include modifying bond amounts and procedures for detention, an end to the practice of using arrest warrants to collected owed dues, among others."

http://time.com/3732227/eric-holder-ferguson-law-enforcement/

TRUDY.......That was a powefull statement especially for the blog but thankyou !!!!!! I couched basketball male and female.I had a female SSgt tell us one time one a trip to never get in trouble between 2-5 am I asked why She said we are bored to death and when we get a call during that time instead of one person responding everybody does and even if you hadn't done anything you will have done something !!!!!!!She was a black NCO with 8 yrs active duty. MARY was a great person who had played for me for several yrs.She told it like it was.I always remembered what she said because it spoke to preconception.

Whats bothering me is the report on ferguson comes out, the mayor jumps on TV AND NOT ONE SOLUTION WAS OFFERED JUST KNEE JERK RESPONSES.I say that because the people on high knew what was going on and they are still in the CYA mode.There prosecuting attorney gets on TV and pretty much says we know so what..........but to some there is no racism......with what just played out I don't see how that statement can be made.The reality is that ferguson is not isolated.We have seen examples to some greater or lesser degree in all parts of the country...........LATER

Trudy, saw your comments re: "The Erosion of Our Incongruity".

The way I look at it the erosion of the incongruities has been a result of action taken by modern patriots to bring "liberty and justice for all" through the erosion of barriers to the right to vote, the right earn a living, the right earn a living knowing that your employer bears an obligation to keep you safe on your job, etc. And, of course through the various amendments that have been ratified/repealed.

BTW Trudy, your take on "standing alone in a world of nations" is interesting. I can think of times in our nation's history when citizens of other nations called us out on inequalities supported in the law of the day.

SAM.....THIS MORNING ON KBOI IDAHO TALKS LIVE A YOUNG MAN CAME ON AND STATED THE EXACT INCIDENT YOU HAD POSTED HERE HIS NAME WAS GARY I WAS WONDERING IF THAT WAS YOUR SON ?? WHO EVER..... HE WAS VERY UPSET........They were discussing ferguson.The stereo typing was horrible it's a wonder we havnt had anyone of color shot and killed here for no reason.I have always said that the people of Idaho for the most part are good people but we have some butt heads, all you have to do is listen on the radio.

There was also and older lady who was really upset about what she saw as discrimination here.This older white lady had a real sense of how it continues and what drives people to react the way that they do to the discrimination.So there are people out there who say NO to it and mean it.......see you later

Lamont, his name isn't Gary. Do you have a link to it? I'd like to show it to my son.

SAM.......THERE IS NO LINK IT WAS PART OF THE TALK SHOE .....IDAHO TALKS ON KBOI 670AM AT 9-10 AM DAILY........PAUL J SCHINEDER AND CRISS WALTON HOST IT.........THEY TALK DIFFERENT SUBJECTS EVERYDAY.......NOT A BAD SHOW.

TRUDY.......sams son had and incident and we were talking about it,a person on this show said the same happened to them in eagle.

I think you hit the nail on the head, implied superiority.I think dave mentioned or it might have been sam a book about white privelige that touches a nerve.Although it may not be taught directly it is taught.When you look at the history books and realize how slanted they are and then go back and read them again you see it.A GOOD EXAMPLE......THE 9th and 10th cavalry after the civil war.You hear and read about the 7th and custer but the 9th an10th were there first and longer.There sphere of influence was larger and there responsibilty's larger.In the military we use to say..... to be the same as you had to be better than.When you looked at promotions ,medals and various other markers it was very apparent.I will give you this, because there are differences we tend to judge based on what we are culturly comfortable with.That doesn't make those judgements the best.Remember when the staffer accused the Obama children of not having any class and then implied that the Obama's weren't good parents.What that amounted to was the girls didn't dress like white girls and because she didn't agree with Obama's politics they were bad parents.She would not even have thought about doing that to a white couple of the OBAMA'S STATURE.tHE WHOLE ASSUMPTION IS THAT WE CAN SAY ANYTHING WE WANT TO A BLACK.IT'S the paternalistic attitude of they are not as smart as ,there not educated,they live in a slum.YES TRUDY I FEEL THERE IS THE ATTITUDE OF I AM WHITE I AM BETTER THAN.....HENCE THE UGLY AMERICAN OVERSEAS......WHATS CRAZY I SAW THE SAME THING IN WHITE COUNTRY'S BY WHITE AMERICANS....well going to run for awhile got to practice we are playing at ha penny bridge this Saturday and I have a lot of music to get squared away.........later

Yes, after I asked you I did a search on it and it had a bunch of recordings but way too many to sift through.

The fact that it was in Eagle is interesting though. My son works in Eagle, although he lives in Boise because his wife works in Boise. I can't see himself listening to radio shows though or calling into one. As far as I know he doesn't know anyone named Gary.

They are coming over on Sunday so I'll ask them about it and where his incident occurred.

I found this article in Huffington, showing the different perceptions of the police attitudes and probable responses from a white citizen and a black citizen.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/05/st-louis-county-police-race_n_6812758.h...

ALWAYS RIGHT.........I should certainly hope not !!!!!!!!!!! I have had disagreements with everyone on the blog except TRUDY and I think that is because she is new here.I really don't care about different thoughts that is more than welcome and I certainly don't speak for anyone except myself.If you care to disagree with something that I have put forth please feel free.The fact that we talk to each other at length has more to do with how we talk to each other.So if that's a problem ??????? I don't know what to say.Me personaly I prefer to talk to people who arn't baiting each other and can have a conversation without the rudness and name calling.LET THE SPIRIT MOVE YOU !!!!!!

The article below, which recaps the Department of Justice report on the pattern of Civil Rights violations in Ferguson is mind boggling. I don't see how this police department and judicial system can possibly come back from the anger generated by its past behaviors.

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2015/03/ferguson-as-a-criminal-consp...

SAM.....I HAVE READ SEVERAL REPORTS AND THEY ALL SEEM TO COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION,SUBJUGATION THROUGH INTIMADATION.Several things jumped right out,there was no place to go to complain the heirachy was part of what was going on.What bothers me is the fact that had they not had the brown incident it would still be going on.I will say this,the kind of actions we see in ferguson happens in other places and it does happen to white folks also.A poor white community will get the same treatment.Theres will be more insidious because they don't think it's happening to them.The other thing that bothered me about ferguson is that it is not the classic ghetto environment,it is a lower middle class town.I think a lot of assumptions were being made and people were acting based on them.You cant move forward faced with intimidation daily,hourly and when you try to exsplain that some say ignore and move on,you cant !!!!! In this case can you imagine surviving with the police having one hand in your bank account???? I hate to say it but maybe those folks need to challenge every ticket written.They need to jail the hierarchy !!!! They knew.

TRUDY......have you read about the group of native americans who are talking about taking the fed to court for breaking there treaty,who was that and what have they got done .do you know.???

Lamont, the name of the book is "All Souls" by Michael Patrick MacDonald.

SAM....TRUDY....LET ME MAKE SURE OF SOMETHING OK ,BEAR WITH ME.......ARE WE AT WAR ???? DID ONE OF YOU ATTACK THE AMERICAN INDIANS ??????I was just wondering???? So please help me out here so I don't get the wrong idea......OK !!! I didn't know I was at WAR with anyone,but I guess if you agree with a black on anything you are capitulating.Funny choice of words !!!!! For whatever it's worth that's a way of looking at a conversation in and adverserial way that will never solve anything.

TRUDY.....SAM....I AM GLAD WE CAN TALK WITH RESPECT,THAT WONT CHANGE ON MY PART.......!!!!!!

Same here on the respect.

And that may be the answer to the racial divide as well. How to get people to respect each other in the discussion of it, so that it doesn't turn into name calling.

The Atlantic editorial below talks about Ferguson and other Fergusons in America and how there does't seem to be a lot of progress in some places than Selma, Alabama 50 years ago.

It alludes to the same pattern in Selma. A white police force controlled by a white minority against black people in the city.

http://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/selma-and-ferguson?intcid=mod-latest

Yes, I did see that Trudy. There are pockets of areas in America that are just as bad as 50 years ago.

I never heard this in college, or in my work place, or in my family when I was growing up.

I did hear it once from two relatives by marriage. I was disgusted. And this wasn't in the South. These were two people that were raised in Idaho.

I HATE TO SAY THIS but there was nothing surprising there.The only thing I hope is that there continues to be people like you that don't buy into that garbage.The thing that keeps some of us going is the realization that it cant last forever I wont see it but it will stop.

The children are a reflection of the parents it's the same reflection we point at in terms of welfare.There is a leader there that instigated and created that atmosphere he/she is the dangerous one.The rest are sheep being cool.The group mentality,the need to be part of.

I guess they will say the president is at fault. I guess he is .......he got elected and every bigot and his brother got a cause......how sick is that??? And were out there telling others about how to live.....hello !!!!!!!

NO I am not mad just disappointed !!!!!!! this is 2015 !!!!!!! not 1915.I live this garbage everyday of my life and some think it's fair and right..........ha !!!!!!!!!and they say it's not happening.....yeah on what planet???

lamont, both of those people that I spoke of are dead.

They were not able to pass on their prejudices to their grandchildren. The children had other's also influencing them.

My son is very close to those grandchildren. He and my nephew used to call each other brothers. This is what I am noticing from the younger generation except in the pocket areas. They really don't have prejudice. The current generation growing up, except those pocket areas just aren't racists.

BTW, I did ask my son about Gary and the radio program. He doesn't know anybody named Gary and his incident occurred in Boise not Eagle.

Trudy, I didn't pledge either but it was more the case that I was going to college and working part-time and didn't have the time or interest.

In Idaho, I think that the racism is more against Mexicans. That doesn't make it any better. I know of one person who is employed to guard the border between the United States and Mexico. He is spreading rumors about Mexicans bringing disease to the United State and because he is there people believe him, not taking into account that he starts off with a very prejudicial attitude.

SAM......TRUDY ......you two crack me up........thank god we can laugh sometimes it's the only saving grace.

I PLAYED a town here years ago that had never been around a live black person......Hagerman.The experience for one of my band members was surreal he was young from N.Y. AND HAD NEVER DEALT WITH IT BEFORE.It was a prom it was a chance to make a difference and we did.The band was interacial there were 8 of us and we had 4 and 4.The kids talked and were curious we talked and answered questions that was in the 70's.About 5 yrs ago I had a person in boise walk up to me were I was playing and said to me he was one of those kids in Hagerman.He talked at length about that exsperience and thanked me for playing his prom....needless to say it made my day.It still amazeses me how many places are like that in Idaho.That doesn't bother me as much as people assuming what they see on TV is real ,that bothers me.I noticed that my granchildrens friends don't seem to care much about your skin color.AS one said to my grandaughter is that your granpa?? KAYLA SAID YES tHE KID SAID..... HOW COOL IS THAT. !!!!!!!!!!! have a good day....later

Your friend may be partially right but for the wrong reasons. Yes, if the races were switched there would be a lot more attention to the story but that is because there isn't a history of white people suffering Civil Right's violations so it becomes a situation that maybe isn't about race but just three guys having a conflict that got out of hand.

On the other hand, the retired guy is probably too old to be carrying a gun but that's another topic so I won't go there.

TRUDY

1- YES IT WOULD HAVE MADE THE NEWS.

2- RETIRED POLICE OFFICERS IN N.Y. ARE REQUIRED TO CARRY THERE FIREARMS I BELIEVE.

3- IF AS A WITNESS SAYS HE WAS ASSAULTED IT'S A LEGAL SHOOT

4- N.Y. POLICE DEPT IS DOING WHAT IT DOES CIRCLING THE WAGONS

5- I agree it should hit the news circuit however this is going to come under stand your ground.If he walked away once only to be confronted again.,they might not have thought it news worthy which I might add I disagree with.

I COULDNT FOR SOME REASON SEE THE VIDEO BUT I DID GO TO THE BLOG SITE AND READ THE ARTICLE.I think people forget something and that is that minorities are more likely to be shot by lawenforcement than there majority group counterpart.N.Y. has just recently had one were the person was shot in a stairwell by accident because the officer was walking the stairwell with his weapon drawn.That city really doesn't want to talk about officer related shooting that don't involve the commission of a crime such as robbery etc.Unfortunatly I am sure they downplayed this incident.The other part is if someone felt it was wrong were are there advocates saying that??? I don't see anything wrong with having white advocates,they should speak up.I don't know about the demonstrations.

SAM...I don't think there is and age limit on the carry by a retired police officer.The one who shot that guy in the movie theatre was 70.I am not saying there shouldn't be.

I think that sometimes you need headlines to get needed action on a problem. If the races were switched, it would be hard for a lot of people to not think that this was just another shooting of a Black person for racial reasons.

The media that is liberal, leans liberal, or is moderate may very well err on the side of discrimination having occurred.

On the other hand the media that is conservative or leans conservative may be just as likely to say that it isn't about race if the races were switched.

Money? What do you mean?

Advertising and ratings are important to these news agencies, but the importance seems to vary.

Bill O'Reilly has been caught lying multiple times, but Fox News is keeping him because of his ratings.

Many News agencies deny that race is a problem, so they are apparently either going against the chance for ratings or their customer base wants to deny that race is a problem. They would pick the first headline.

Fox News wouldn't pick the first or second headline. They want to go after Obama or Clinton dirt.

I'm not that cynical, I admit, but I believe that when someone prints a headline "White Officer Guns Down Unarmed Black Man In N.Y.Subway Station" that there was a valid reason for including race in the headlines. Now if only one newspaper is picking that story, then I discern that the newspaper may be inaccurate.

We will have to agree to disagree on that, Trudy. Any information pertinent to the news story should be in the headline, supported by the news story.

TRUDY.........I have to agree money in my opinion plays a big part in the way the headline is written.Unfortunatly I have to consider the possible bias of the person who constructs that headline.There have been several real incidents in my opinion that should have made the papers and didn't.At the same time of trayvon martin a black guy shot a white guy in a park in florida under stand your ground that should have hit the news and didn't.I never could find out what happened there but I considered it murder not stand your ground. The white on black overode the black on white,they were pretty much the same to me.As a matter of fact the park shooting was more egregious because he left the park to get his gun.

I do get it about people who want things to stay the same but I hope your friend is including both sides of the racial divide.The friend needs to remember that the irresponsible behavior starts with irrational behavior towards people some don't consider there equals and therefore are deserving of inhuman treatment.I am sure you have had this conversation with them.....sorry.

Trudy I am retired and I am very healthy and capable even after a 2 yr battle with cancer.I don't look my age nor do I walk with a limp or anything I guess he felt his gun was the answer it seems that the older you get the more that comes into play.Me, although I always fired expert I hated qualifying especially after coming home from namm I had to be ordered to go.I still don't like weapons.

SAM has several good points especially about those agency's that don't think there is a race problem.Unfortunatly they in my opinion have there heads in the sand,easier to deny than to confront or confirm. As you say SAM sensationalism sells advertisement it also has and impact that cant be measured in the human equation.......tried to keep it short......later

Trudy, maybe if in the South in the early 1900's the newspapers had printed something like these headlines, we would have a different situation than we have today.

"14 year old Black child hung by Ku Klux Klan for being uppity".

By not printing the relevant information, then we are burying it. I know that you think that newspapers are sensationalizing the news but in this case, how many centuries must go by before people pay attention and people do something about it.

If the crime is racially motivated then that is about a problem that we have in this country and the headline shouldn't just say "A man killed another man". The headline should talk about the issue and not hide it.

It doesn't matter whether is was a black against white crime or a white against black crime.

TRUDY.....I was stationed at dover deleware.....deleware state coll.was just down the road, not many white kids there,complete reversal.I never heard any of that garbage there.I will say there were some racist there,they did not see themselves that way but they were.I also realize that deleware in parts of it is very racist.It's like a border state go north in the state it is progressive go south and it gets very right wing,and in between all of that you get the amish.

I don't think anything would have hit the papers if a fraternity on a traditional black institution had done the same thing.I DO KNOW THAT THE PRESIDENT OF THE INSTITUTION WOULD HAVE DONE THE SAME THING.I called and asked my son about HOWARD and he said no way !!!!! you would have gotten kicked out.Asked my brother about CENTRAL STATE he said the same. he also said ,there were racist there.Racism is not a oneway street we all know that,the difference is who has power and who does not.Control of the instatutions is the key, that's part of the reason for the vitrol with THE PRESIDENT.

SAM I think people get scared and think that could be me.If we go strictly by skin color it becomes scary to realize what happened to the jews in Europe,and some people say that could have been me.Dont forget we turned our back on them at first,racism??? YES.I sometimes think we have a guilt thing going on with Israel,and to some greater or lesser degree they are still discriminated against the difference is they can hide(name change) I cant change my color.IN N.Y. jews and blacks will defend each other,why? we are the only peoples enslaved for life.Makes for strange bedfellows........smile!!!!! later

I have the news on in the background as I'm working and the Ferguson story with the two policemen being shot is getting a lot of coverage. Both sides want the shooter(s) to be arrested and punished.

It doesn't look to me like "the national media continues to trumpet only the Black causes".

TRUDY.....IMO... you have got it right.The problem is they should be protesting and calling to task all police violence no matter who it is perpetrated on.If you will do it to one you will do it to all.There is not only the racial element here there is the police bias element of us against them attitude.This guy acted from a racial stand point and it should be a hate crime.But he will probably walk between stand your ground and N.Y.P.D. circling the wagons.YES it is wrong has been for years.N.Y. can thank RUDY for the animosity on both sides.

TRUDY.....I don't get were anyone is protesting WILSON.I do get the anger about the report.I also feel that the people who did the shooting did not have anyones best intrest at heart.From the description of were the shots came from anyone could have got shot or they were a very good shot.If they did use a hand gun that person has military training.

The white out as MORGAN called it is exactly that.I feel there is no exscuse for it and I have stated that.We as a society have created that. Sensationalism sells papers and news etc.The news coverage we receive is based on ratings not public interest or need to know.This has enchanced the racial divide so now we have white folks feeling like they don't get there just due and I agree they don't.I would be the first to admit that you have to have at least some black officers who would play payback.That would be human nature and not to be unexspected.

I have to say this people need to get off of SHARPTON. AL IS SIMPLY A VOICE.........when others speak up nobody listens.I don't hear anyone getting in RUSHES face and to me he is even more offensive,and he is a race baiting idiot.

Officer Wilson was outweighted by 20 lbs I am not sure that justifies emptying your service revolver,do we shoot to kill or to stop whatever violence is going on ???WE are not on the battlefield. As you have stated Trudy there are many horrific cases some I knew of a lot I didn't.I think they all have one thing in common that should concern us all and that is questionable violence by the police and the lack of none biased reporting.These things keep the pot boiling.......later

Trudy I'm not interested in discussing this particularly slant of the topic any more.

TRUDY.....I COULDN'T CONNECT THROUGH ANY OF YOUR LINKS,,,,,,COULD BE MY COMPUTER ??????

I don't think brown is the cause celeb there are better cases. I think he became the straw,unfortunetly what got buried was the real reason for the protests. That was the systemic subjugation that nobody could break or at least they didn't try hard enough.Point being that things are still going on that should not be.It reads like something out the early 1900's.The frustration is when, just when is it going to stop!!!!!That frustration is very volital very.!!!I see ferguson and it's political machine as an impediment to progress.The need of some to attempt to insure there is no change is the real threat be it overt or covert.!!!!!!!!

And I should add, that the conditions that went on in Ferguson had nothing to do with how things were reported. This had gone on for years with no national attention. When Michael Brown was killed then it did get the attention of the media and by then it was the last straw for some people in Ferguson.

The links weren't working for me either. On the you tube link it begins with https: so it could be that you are logged on to you tube so your link won't work for us. You need to go into you tube, not as logged in to collect the link.

I'm not sure why the other links weren't working. I did find one link to an Alabama news site that did work.

THANKYOU ...TRUDY BUT I HAVE TO CONFESS.....I SPENT 13 YRS TEACHING HUMAN RELATIONS ALONG WITH DRUG ALCOHOL COUNCILING AND EQUAL OPPERTUNITY AND TREATMENT,CALLED US SOCIAL ACTIONS TECH IN THE MILITARY.I was among the first, went to the Defense Race Relations Institute and was offered a chance to go on staff there but I did not want to be in coa coa beach florida.School enviroments are ok but there not the real world.MY MOM was and activist in her day IN BKLYN N.Y. WERE I WAS BORN AND RAISED.sHE WAS PART OF SHIRLEY CHISOLMS STAFF.....I WAS RAISED IN IT......SMILE.anyhow I kinda like a good fight........smile.....doc's say that's why I recovered so well from the cancer treatments especially at my age......I say I have not finished whatever it is the higher power has put me here to do so I keep on keepin on........later

again THANKYOU !!!!!!!!

Trudy, having the news people there does encourage the protesting, that can't be helped, and maybe doesn't need to be repeated. The point has been made.

However the news people weren't there when the police were abusing their power for years and people were getting angry, being criminalized, and paying serious money for bogus traffic fines. People were trying to get help and weren't getting it. By the news people publicizing the events, the city is now undergoing some forced changes by the Department of Justice.

TRUDY....I HAD A GOOD TIME THERE...PARTYIED THE BEACH ETC But I had already bought a house here and I liked it here for the most part.Being interracially married and florida did not mix in 1975 kinda limited were you could go etc.As long as you stayed in the milburn coa coa beach area you were ok.Went to Kessler afb miss. for instructor school, the base commander greets us with.......I am told social actions people are different so let me tell you as long as you don't travel north of here I can guarantee your safety here in Biloxi........at least he was honest ,but who the hell wants to be somewhere like that.Some people had there spouses and a lot of us were interracially married,probally more than was normal at the time.

PATRICK AFB is right on the beach all you had to do was walk across the hiway.The NCO CLUB WAS ON THE BEACH,some of the best seafood I had ever eaten WAS IN THAT AREA.School was tough,hi wash out and long hours7-7 was a normal day and research on the weekends.They changed you in 16 wks,it was joint service so all branches were there,all ranks in class e-5 thru lt col.Rank didn't count for academics SO THERE WAS A FREE FLOW OF IDEAS'S,YOU AND SAM WOULD HAVE LIKED IT.

FERGUSON.... I think the media is doing exactly what we have talked about and at some point it is counterproductive.I have listened to some people from the city government and I would think they need to shut this down and get on with making the changes.I AM NOT SURE WHAT IS TO BE GAINED BY A CONTINUENCE.......IF they want someone else gone state it !!!!!! I would.I could see the mayor and the prosecutor gone.Both of those people had to be aware of what was going on.At this point the anger is misguided that's my opinion.

If this protest is part of a larger question ,that is the one that is nation wide then the behavior is totally out of line.Police brutality in poor neighbehoods is real,racial profiling is real, to me the only way to stop that is the courts and sue the hell out of the place it happens in.Then the people who condone this garbage have some skin in the game. The problem is how many people get hurt or killed till it stops.IT HAPPENS RIGHT HERE IN IDAHO,IN MTN HOME,BOISE,CALDWELL,MERIDIAN,NAMPA BUT IF PEOPLE DONT SPEAK UP ABOUT IT IT WILL CONTINUE.I SAY YOU GIVE THE TOWN THE OPPERTUNITY TO CHANGE IT THEN YOU GO HIGHER.SOME CHANGES HAD TO BE MADE IN MTN HOME, WE ARE NOT PERFECT.At least they were made.!!!!! LATER

CoolBreeze, for Ferguson there was no Federal Grand Jury, there was a Federal investigation which produced a report which a few of us have read and have been discussing. So who are you calling a race baiter?

lamont, I think the Ferguson prosecutor should also at the very least have to resign because of how he allowed the Grand Jury case to be handled. I know there are rules against having a witness testify that you know is lying. That's suborning perjury.

This is what McCullough said.

"Well, early on, I decided that anyone who claimed to have witnessed anything was going to be presented to the grand jury. And I knew that no matter how I handled it, there would be criticism of it. So if I didn't put those witnesses on, then we'd be discussing now why I didn't put those witnesses on. Even though their statements were not accurate.

So my determination was to put everybody on and let the grand jurors assess their credibility, which they did...

There were people who came in and, yes, absolutely lied under oath.Some lied to the FBI. Even though they're not under oath, that's another potential offense -- a federal offense.

I thought it was much more important to present the entire picture."

http://www.atlredline.com/did-robert-mcculloch-just-admit-to-suborning-perjury-1...

They were lying for Wilson, which in a way is against Brown, Trudy. One example, is the person that the FBI proved could not have even been a witness, testified in favor of Wilson.

CoolBreeze calls everyone that disagrees with him "Wayne". He's called me that, which is kind of a compliment. I know Wayne, although I haven't e-mailed him for awhile. He is a good, fair-minded guy.

SAM .......I thought I HAD INCLUDED MC CULLOGH.Anyhow I have come to the conclusion that some of those black council people should go also.Unless they can prove that the information about the traffic stops/arrest was hidden from them they are part of the problem.The other thing could be they didn't have access to the info although I cant think of why not. In case I didn't say it before the mayor needs to go also.He is the overseer of it all.

The media needs to focus on the issues and not sensationalism,I know that doesn't sell papers or advertisement.IT will get someone killed which is what almost transpired.I don't like the fact the chief got paid to discriminate and that payment included his walk out the door.That is those peoples tax dollars, everyone in that town should be ******.Every person sentenced by that judge should have a case review,every one !!!!.BLACK OR WHITE.

Trudy......I think he was talking about both.

He may have been talking about both but the one clearly flagrant lie about even being a witness was someone that was allowed to testify for Wilson.

TRUDY......NO.....I HADNT HEARD THAT STORY.

I WOULD AGREE THAT IF POSSIBLE CLEAN HOUSE ALL OF THEM The problem is I don't think the community will let the black council members go,they need to.Your not over simplifying it.

I want the shooter caught now !!!!!If they don't that becomes a very dangerous situation there,people are up tight anything can happen.

Trudy, I believe that there were some people that lied on both sides, and some people remembered things differently. When I lived in downtown Portland, Oregon a homeless person attacked another person and then ran. There were several eyewitnesses including myself.

Everyone agreed that the attack had occurred but when the police asked for a description of the attacker everyone remembered him differently. I have Eidetic memory, and can remember everything that makes an impression like a movie that I can play over again in my mind. I couldn't believe that the other people were describing the actions, and the clothes, of the person differently from what I saw.

Well, they caught the guy and brought him in front of us and we all said that was him. He was as I had described him, dressed as I had described him. The other people hadn't lied. They had remembered things differently.

The thing with McCullough, is that there are things that don't seem possible and things that are really a lie. The woman that said she witnessed the incident that wasn't even there wasn't remembering things differently. She was clearly lying.

You shouldn't really sum it up as both sides lied. The article doesn't support that, except for the woman that wasn't even a witness.

I brought up McCullough and how he handled the jury for why he should resign. He said that he had allowed to testify people that he knew lied. There's probably 100 witnesses, maybe more. Do you really want to examine what each said they saw? I don't.

SAM....I GET WHAT YOU ARE SAYING.I think there was another player there and the more testimony the more confusing it got.I don't want to second guess the gran jury but once the assault was in play brown loses.I HAVE A PROBLEMM WITH THE VIDEO SHOWING HIM ON HIS KNESS AND WILSON STILL FIRING.Be that as it may the assault ended the conversation.I think the prosecutor anticipated that and just let the testimony do what it wanted.He did have a point, if he hadn't let someone testify then he would have been accused of hiding something.I guess you could call it a wash.I can see both sides.

I think the biggest issue now is this whole thing is not about BROWN ANYMORE. IT IS ABOUT SUBJUGATION AND HOW IT WAS INSTATUTIONALIZED WITH THE BLESSING OF THE LEGAL STRUCTURE IN PLACE.There are so many levels to this that need to be explored that we cant.I will say that the community also bears some responsibility here also, especially those blacks that were on the city council.!!!!!!!!

Trudy, your Washington Post link is to the Volokh Conspiracy which the Washington Post "hosts" but retains no control on the editorial content. The editorial that you posted from the Volokh Conspiracy was one of a series of several articles where the author claimed that the grand jury was a fair proceeding, claimed that witnesses that supported the case against Wilson were not credible and witnesses that supported that deadly force was necessary were credible. The author cherry picked his witnesses and showed his bias through the many articles.

Also when you said "two investigations cleared Wilson and he has resigned". A grand jury failing to charge someone is not "clearing" him.

The Federal Investigation said in part "Mistake, fear, misperception, or even poor judgment do not constitute willful conduct prosecutable under the statute." For that reason the Federal report said "Because Wilson did not act with the requisite criminal intent, it cannot be proven beyond reasonable doubt to a jury that he violated 18 U.S.C.§ 242 when he fired his weapon at Brown. Conclusion: For the reasons set forth above, this matter lacks prosecutive merit and should be closed."

If you are really interested in a more balanced review of the witnesses read the below report.

http://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/0...

I personally don't want to waste more time discussing the witnesses because I think it is straying from the topic of the blog which is an important topic.

When you say "My opinion is, that Mr. Brown caused his own death by his own actions" you sound like you are placing the full blame on Brown without taking into consideration Wilson's actions.

When you say "Justice was served" then you are implying that the outcome of Michael Brown being killed with several shots was okay.

A Black person in an encounter with the police, is more likely than a White person to have deadly force used against him all other things being equal. The poor are also discriminated against in this way, as well as other minorities. That isn't okay particularly when there is a death.

This is how the New York times described Ferguson based on the FBI report of Ferguson and its Civil Rights violations.

"The report, based on a six-month investigation, provides a glimpse into the roots of the racial tensions that boiled over in Ferguson last summer after a black teenager, Michael Brown, was fatally shot by a white police officer, making it a worldwide flash point in the debate over race and policing in America. It describes a city where the police used force almost exclusively on blacks and regularly stopped people without probable cause. Racial bias is so ingrained, the report said, that Ferguson officials circulated racist jokes on their government email accounts."

I gather from your comments that either you don't believe the FBI report or you think that Darren Wilson, trained and supervised by the same police force that regularly discriminated against the Black people in town, was on his good behavior that day and just did what he had to do. Logic tells me that is not likely.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/04/us/justice-department-finds-pattern-of-police-...

Everyone on the Ferguson police force, whether white or black, was aware of the pattern of Civil Rights violations against Blacks. Wilson either participated in it or condoned it. The excerpt, below is from CNN.

"The Justice Department completed a months-long review of the case and released those results Wednesday. The report cites "unlawful bias against and stereotypes about African-Americans," and points to a number of violations of constitutional rights.

Attorney General Eric Holder said a "highly toxic environment" existed between Ferguson police officers and the city's African-American residents before Officer Darren Wilson shot and killed Michael Brown last year.

"It's not difficult to imagine how a single tragic incident set off the city of Ferguson like a powder keg," Holder said.

He pointed to the use of excessive force overwhelmingly against African-American residents, noting that only African-Americans were bit by police dogs, and said "no alternative explanation" except racial bias exists to explain it.

Holder also said Ferguson's police department violated residents' First Amendment rights to record the activities of officers, regularly conducted illegal searches and unlawfully detained citizens and competed with each other to "see who can issue the largest number of citations in a single stop."

He said the city's municipal courts and local government "relies on the police force to serve essentially as a collection agency."

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/04/politics/ferguson-justice-report-shocking/

TRUDY.......OH BOY CAN I AGREE WITH THE LAST POST,nOTHING CHANGED IN THE MILITARY UNTIL SOME GENERAL OFFICERS RETIRED,THAT IS A FACT.

THE INCIDENT WE HAD HERE IN THE 70'S NOTHING CHANGED UNTIL THEY FIRED SOME PEOPLE STARTING WITH THE WING COMMANDER RIGHT HERE.YES THERE WAS DISOBEDIENCE AND SOME PEOPLE GOT THROWN OUT AND SOME STOOD COURTS MARTIALS.POINT BEING THEY WERE HELPLESS TO AFFECT THE CHANGE IT HAD TO COME FROM ON HIGH.It takes a certain amount of bravery to speak against a system that you are part of knowing that same system can eat you alive, especially if it doesn't affect you!!!!!!!

SAM...I don't know wether Wilson was a good guy or a bad one,I do question the totality of his actions which I have stated.I would have to say that in the face of keeping his job and the place he probally sat in the heirachy he was not going to say to much, he was going to go along to get along.MY guess would be if he was a good guy he was outnumbered.The question is does that make him in his heart a bad guy I don't know only he knows.That doesn't make him any less a part of the problem.In our investigations we usually found the good people didn't participate in most of the actions of the others. They did enough to stay beneath the radar.

I think now that the chief is gone and some others will go also a lot of things will come out.Someone will have to be given immunity from prosecution and it will all come out.!!!!I think we need to remember that there is no statute of limitation on murder.There are five people in the firing line 3 are gone and 2 remain.Whoever takes over should ask for the resignations of the city council,the prosecutor,and the current police chief if he was the deputy to the out going chief.It should be made clear to all that this is about the systemic violations of the people of fergusons civil rights all of them, whites and black.Hire from within the city IF you can and assure the people are QUALIFIED and understand the task they will be undertaking.ELECT a NEW city council.CITY that small I don't understand the need for a city manager eliminate that position and save some money.

TRUDY........Wilson can't have it both ways based on his own testimony that didn't happen imo.Me personally you could not hold me with that hold never.Wilson might have reached to grab his shirt or something but not his throat.I find it hard to believe a trained officer would have even reached out of the window to grab someone,that would immediately place him in a defensive position.IF he WAS right handed that would really be awkward.A SIMPLE CHOP DOWN AND I AM FREE I AM A VERY STRAIGHT 6'0 195LBS,AND I WOULD HAVE TO BEND OVER FOR YOU TO GET ME IN THAT POSITION AND YOUR SITTING DOWN.YOU LOOSE !!!!!! I don't see it happening.

Knowing the hood I found the friends testimony questionable,a lot of self imposed pressure to say what he thought people wanted to hear.He still has to live there and he lost a friend.He doesn't feel like he owes the system anything and the system sure hasn't treated him fairly in his opinion. He has no reason to be totally truthfull.

I don't care about the brown case I care about the ferguson case. Yes the death is important, but the lives of every citizen is at risk in that town and other towns just like it.

TRUDY both you and SAM HAD SOME HELL OF A POINTS BUT THERE ARE SOME WE WILL NEVER PIN DOWN AND THAT'S OK AT LEAST WE EXPLORED IT.There are a lot of applications here that ought to at least come to fruition in our own lives, anyone of us doesn't have all the answers,collectively we got a lot !!!!!!!!! later

TRUDY........THERE WAS AND INCIDENT THAT WILSON GOT A MEDAL FOR THAT WAS QUESTIONED !!!!!! HE got a citation for that I am going to say this and I have no facts ok........they may have given him a citation but the way they wrote it up vers how the people affected tell it are not the same.That incident doesn't surface but it is there it could be it cant be questioned or that they don't want to question it or it's valid.I don't know it was mentioned.I am not trying to break him down but if there going to make this about ones character then it's open house on all of it. !!!!!!later

I read an article about that. Wilson without probable cause demanded to be able to search a vehicle that was parked in the owners grandmother's driveway. The owner put the key in his pocket and then Wilson cuffed him in a painful way I guess because of the man's weight it was difficult to put his hands behind his back. To cuff him there had been a little bit of wrestling and Wilson got a medal.

GEORDY......HOW YOU BEEN ? tHANKS I KNEW IT WAS OUT THERE SOMEWHERE.

I've been good. How about you?

Your memory of the information appears to be wrong. Why not do a search on it?

That's alright Geordy. Here is the link.

1. The police claimed that Wilson was called to the scene. The police didn't document what call Wilson responded to.

2. It looked like the case was going to be kicked out because Wilson wasn't going to testify.

3. The attorney for the guy arrested, told him not to file a complaint until after the court case.

4. The prosecutor decided to not charge the suspect with resisting arrest.

http://news.yahoo.com/attorney-ferguson-police-officer-darren-wilson-roughed-up-...

If the Police Chief, the mayor, and the prosecutor are allowing systematic Civil Right's violations why would they reprimand Wilson for "profiling and mistreating Black community members?"

As far as complaints go, you don't know that he didn't have a complaint in seven years for two reasons.

1. The poor and black community members had nobody to complain to that wouldn't just make things tougher on them.

2. Complaints until recently were not stored with the policeman's file but with the case that was being charged. You couldn't look up complaints for a policeman.

I think it says a lot that in the example that I provided a link to, the suspect was only going to be tried for having marijuana to sell but was not going to be tried for resisting arrest which was all over Wilson's description of events in the police report. It sounds to me like someone didn't want there to be an open discussion in court of just what occurred in that driveway in regards to force.

The report has comments in multiple places of Wilson fearing for his safety. Maybe he was in the wrong job?

However, that being said, I'm not going to discuss this anymore.

I will say this........I have a problem with the fact that Wilson seemed to enter into things that under most circumstances and officer would call for back up before acting.That includes both incidents as reported.He may very well be a good guy but he ether thinks he is a hero or he has a total disregard for procedure.Procedure designed to keep him safe first and foremost and provide a witness to events.Wilson needs to change jobs or get a better handle on it or he will die. Given his demonstration for lack of procedure it does raise questions about what he is doing.I agree you can file charges after the fact but I don't think your going to do that when your in the wrong, which brooks obviously was.Based on what was going on in ferguson I am surprised that anyone said anything about anything.I think the risk involved there has to be stated and that would be high.That is a very real fear when you don't have any power and don't perceive anyone is on your side.SCARY!!!!!!! These are my thoughts and it gives me reason to pause.The system failed on so many fronts I don't think we can place blame on any one thing or individual.That means that every one in that community was at risk.

For him I think so !!!!!!! HE has too much risky behavior.For Ferguson there is so much work to do that you have to wonder were to start.I WOULD LIKE TO SEE WORK STARTED ON THE POPULATION.MAINLY EDUCATION ON SOME REAL BASIC ISSUES AND THE BUSINESS OF GOVERNING. I know wishfull thinking !!!!!!!!! oh well

Ferguson can fight the needed changes or they can get better: stop the Civil Rights Violations and give the police better training and mentoring.

I have to agree the shots fired were all in the same vicinity in terms of height,in my mind he was trying to head shoot someone.I don't believe he was in a car either the shot group was to much together.I think he wanted to get the police to fire on the crowd.I am thankfull that didn't happen.I don't understand why he is not being charged with attempted murder on a police officer.He should be facing life.

He was not street smart at all.he is for sure a want to be something????I cant believe he thought he could get away with it.I'll bet someone turned him in or at least gave info to get him.WELL LETS SEE WHAT TOMORROW BRINGS.

TRUDT.........I WENT TO NAMM FIRST TIME IN 1962 TDY FROM JAPAN, WENT PCS IN 1967 CAME HOME 1970 WENT BACK IN 1971 HOME IN 1972.I knew something about it but I never paid it much attention 68-69 was tough in the states I was busy....smile....I knew we comprised about 30% of the combat arms during the war(13% OF POP).So if we were safer there that is saying something.Every one depended on everyone else so the bigots for the most part didn't have time to practice....laugh !!!!!!I WENT TO and aircraft school in vegas in 1967 while there I met and went out with a lady. I got threatened by this guy who was going over also ,,,,,he said..... I will kill you when we get over there..... I said to him every body's gets a gun see you there'''''''.By the time he left we were good friends.IT was kinda funny how that garbage there affected people.Me and her are friends to this day, almost married.

I hope most policeman have a more professional attitude.

Why has this shooter case taken over the discussion of the national discussion of race? The shooting doesn't seem to be about race whether he was aiming at someone in the crowd or the police.

Here is an example, that is on topic, IMO, where some people are thinking that holding up the Loretta Lynch nomination for Attorney General has a racial factor. She has been waiting four months. Nobody seems to have an objection to her and most agree that she is well qualified yet, the Senate refuses to vote on her nomination.

Other people were nominated for other offices after her and they were voted on long ago. But Lynch is being used to manipulate votes on bills that have nothing to do with a vote on her nomination. I think it is because she is black and because she is a woman. The Republicans, while not being overtly racist and sexist, are doing it because they think that they can get away with it since she is black and a woman.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/17/politics/loretta-lynch-race-attorney-general-vote/

I SWEAR YOU CANT MAKE THIS UP !!!!!! I REMEBER THIS FROM THE JAGS WALL ......IF YOU CAN GET THEM TO TALK YOU CAN CONVICT.......END OF STORY !!!!!HIS LAWYER IS NOW DOING THE TALKING,If the police did there job right it is to late.Do I believe he fell no but who am I???? MAYBE HE OUGHT TO BE GLAD HE IS IN POLICE CUSTODY.....the protesters might not be thinking to kindly that he could have shot anyone of them.....He is a real peace of work.They have already disowned him.I'd bet one of them turned him in. There was absolutely no reason for his actions none!!!!!All he wanted was to be cool to his buddies.wELL THEY DIDNT THINK HE WAS COOL.

I disagree with both of those points.

Trudy wants to wallow in her hate.

I read the CNN article about Lynch and the delays, Sam. I think that there is a lot of truth in this being about her being black and being a woman.

On the SURFACE of it, it looks like the Republican's are delaying it to gain ground on unrelated bills and there may be some truth to that, but I took a look at a couple of the EXTREMELY, EXTREME right wing web sites and they tell a different story. They are claiming that it is all a plan to prevent someone that they feel is "like" Eric Holder from being Attorney General. To that end, the right wing web sites are trying to start a false story that she covered up drug lords and terrorists. Of course you can't trust those web sites to know what they are talking about but they do talk the talk of the Tea Party, like a lot of Republicans do.

What the Republicans in the Senate are doing is what they think they can get away with since she is black and a woman and they are trying to prevent another black Attorney General.

My personal opinion is that you seem to have a lot of hate for the accused shooter that extends to his attorney who is doing his job. I think that you should take a step back and consider whether you have lost perspective on the issue.

Even McCulloch the questionable district attorney thinks that the motive for the shooting may have been a personal issue with others in the crowd. Check out the Atlantic article. It may not be about race.

Sam, even Rudy Giuliani who is no friend to Democrats is telling the Republicans to knock it off on delaying the vote.

Audi, it's good to see you back!

I saw the Rudy Giuliani letter to Lindsay Graham which said in part.

"How we treat nominees like Ms. Lynch has important constitutional implications," Giuliani says in the Monday letter, which was provided to POLITICO. "The scope and the breadth of the advice and consent function of the U.S. Senate has been much debated. My interpretation has always been that a president should be given the deference to choose his Cabinet unless the nominee is unqualified to do the job, has a history of unethical behavior or is so ideologically rigid as to be incapable of making rational choices in the public interest."

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2015/03/rudy-giuliani-loretta-lynch-support-116154...

Sometime Rudy Giuliani makes a good point. I noticed that White Privilege has been discussed. Sally Kohn wrote "Eight Things Every White Person Should Know About White Privilege". You might enjoy her list of pointers.

1. "There is more than one kind of racial bias." It is not just the Bundy's of the world but those that use the nuances of racism - they hate Obama more than seems reasonable considering the issues, those that use expressions like "welfare Queens", and "the takers".

2. "Racial bias is baked into America's past." -- It has had a longer time to set in, than in trying to get rid of it.

3. "Implicit racial bias persists in America's present." -- There are still patterns of racism, in arrests, school spending, etc. that continue to keep black people down economically, and therefore ill-equipped to fight it.

4. "It is inherently, statistically harder to succeed in America if you're black or brown."

5. "Pointing out racial bias doesn't make the pointer-outer racist." -- This is just a ploy, used by conservatives to try to prevent racism being pointed out.

6. "Admitting racial bias in America doesn't mean it's your fault." -- It's not a blame game, but admitting it so that it can be fixed.

7. "Racial bias is also not the fault of people of color." -- Just like blaming anti-Semitism on Jews.

8. "Your (false) sense of solidarity in denying racial bias isn't serving you well at all."

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/05/07/white-privilege-at-princeton-ne...

Back on the topic of the Loretta Lynch confirmation, and the arbitrary delay on voting, The Hill had a news article with this quote from the Senate Minority Whip, Dick Durbin.

"The Republican majority leader announced... that he was going to hold this nomination of Loretta Lynch until the bill which is pending before the Senate passes, whenever that may be," Durbin said. "And so Loretta Lynch, the first African-American woman nominated to be attorney general, is asked to sit in the back of the bus when it comes to the Senate calendar. That is unfair. It's unjust."

I personally believe this pertains to number 3 of "Eight Things Every White Person Should Know About White Privilege".

http://thehill.com/blogs/floor-action/senate/236087-top-dem-gop-puts-ag-nominee-...

Starbucks is doing something to get the conversation going about racial inequality. I hope that I can mention the company's name and it isn't misconstrued as advertising.

According to USA today that is working with Starbucks on this,

"Starbucks CEO Howard Schultz is on a mission to encourage Starbucks customers and employees to discuss race, under the firm belief that it's a critical first step toward confronting -- and solving -- racial issues as a nation. It is scheduled to be a key topic at the java giant's annual meeting on Wednesday.

"Racial diversity is the story of America, our triumphs as well as our faults," says the opening letter to the eight-page supplement and conversation guide, signed by Schultz and Larry Kramer, president and publisher of USA TODAY. "Yet racial inequality is not a topic we readily discuss. It's time to start."

"The supplement includes race relations "conversation starters," including one fill-in-the-blank question that simply asks: In the past year, I have been to the home of someone of a different race ___ times." It also encourages readers to tweet responses to questions at #RaceTogether such as: How have your racial views evolved from those of your parents?"

For a conversation starter I wonder how others would respond to the question "How have your racial views evolved from those of your parents?"

I would answer it in this way.

1. When I was little, we had a hired hand that was black. White or black, that's what you called someone that did farm work, a hired hand. There are pictures of him holding my brother and I. My parents hadn't known any black people before as far as I know and they were very interested in him and wanted to know more about him. They felt that he was their friend and that he loved my brother and me.

I on the other hand have known black people from the Army. Some liked me and I liked them and some didn't like me and I didn't like them. I encountered prejudice against me because of the assumption that as a white person I was a racist.

After the Army in college I encountered the same thing.

In the work place that has been different. I work with people of multiple races and cultures. One of my Indian (from India) clients recently sent me a vacation picture of his trip to Egypt in front of the Pyramids wearing a Turban. Everybody treats each other with respect. If someone were to be disrespectful, I know that they would be immediately fired.

2, My parents had "white guilt" and my mother overcompensated. My younger brother brought home a black friend and you'd have thought that a prince had arrived.

I don't have white guilt and treat everyone the same.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2015/03/16/starbucks-fast-food-restaurants-r...

Yes, it is different because there was an actual vote, the confirmation was for Secretary of State, and the questions directed to Rice were about the war in IRAQ which is related to the Secretary of State's duties.

I know that the Extreme Right pretend news sites are bringing this up to try to downplay the nefarious behavior of the Senate Republicans but that dog won't hunt.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/ALLPOLITICS/01/26/rice.confirmation/

No, Mike, read the article that I provided the link to. It describes the real issues with Rice that were being debated as she had participated in the discussion with Bush on the war in Iraq and was not forthcoming on the questions, RELATED TO HER PROPOSED JOB.

Sam, is it my imagination or are a couple of people being deliberately obtuse on the subject of the Loretta Lynch confirmation which has been delayed longer than any other confirmation in 30 years?

Audi I think the Lynch confirmation vote is more number 4 than number 3. She has, that is had, two years to make an impact as Attorney General. Now she has about 19 months.

But there is another factor that we aren't considering. Could the Republicans be thinking it is better if you want to slow down racial progress to keep a lame duck in as Attorney General than letting fresh blood in that has less baggage holding her up? Particularly when they fear the changes that a Black Attorney General can do?

It seems inappropriate to direct comments about "histrionics of gender" to people talking about inequality and how that isn't right.

I made the obtuse comment Trudy so no need to berate Geordey.

Geordey, I agree with you on the White Privilege numbers. Lynch overcame the problems of number 3 many years ago. When she was in grade school she took an IQ test and the teachers were so surprised that she scored higher than the white students that they made her take it again and she scored even higher. She was valedictorian of her high school class but the school was concerned that this would cause issues having a black valedictorian so she had to share being valedictorian with two white students. That's long past.

Now she has hurdle 4. She has done all of the right things, and now she has the chance to be Attorney General. Republicans would MAYBE not make a black man wait 4 months for a confirmation vote and MAYBE not make a woman wait 4 months for a confirmation vote, but I think they think that they can do it to someone that has two areas of inequality: being black and a woman.

You are also right, about keeping a lame duck Attorney General in office slowing down racial progress. They are using as an excuse that they don't like that she agrees with Obama on some things like amnesty. That's bogus, because the President gets to select someone that agrees with him or her politically.

Recently, I posted a story about Starbucks and their effort to get the conversation about race going with their employees and now with their customers. That's a good thing, right?

Now the pretend news, speaking for the Tea Party, is posting their backlash to this story. They don't think that a company should be allowed to talk about what they want to talk about in their shops. Headlines are now appearing such as "Starbucks employees now encouraged to berate you over thorny racial issues in America".

Why does the pretend news care so much about this? If they frequent Starbucks, then they can always say they aren't interested in the discussion and they just want to buy some coffee.

But of course the pretend news are all posting pretty much the same thing as if they got a memo from Tea Party Central saying we've got to stop people from talking about race.

That's pretty funny Sam. It's almost like someone hit a nerve.

I think the LYNCH nomination is being held up on both accounts,all things Obama and that she is black...The president is about the future and the asperations of a peoples....I have stated in my opinion that the president has picked black qualified appointees for a very good reason....that reason being the future......what the black child see's today affects what he/she will aspire to tomorrow.He also has shown the country that there are qualified minorities in all fields. He has placed them when they may never have gotten a chance to show there abilities on the national stage.He has made sure they are qualified and in most cases they are overqualified.To reduce the level of visibility helps to insure a sense of superiority.A sense of superiority that has large cracks in it.

Being and entertainer I really noticed he has done the same with the entertainment at the white house.You can see the diversity stamped all over this administration not just in select places but places that normally don't draw any attention and still don't unless you look.Consider this.....the number of blacks who will now be able to PUT ON A RESUME I worked in D.C.for the president of the USA.That alone will increase the number of minorities in high placese.

MICHAEL STEELE...very forcefully brought up the politics of this and his point has merit.But you can't say all things Obama and then not bring race into it.Just saying all things Obama brings in race.

TRUDY......The wife is getting ready for a hip transplant and cancer may be visiting me again so we have been busy.NEXT week will probally be busier.......NO I didnt forget you guys just got things to do .....later

lamont, you and yours are in our prayers.

+MIKE.....you just made the point !!!!!I don't need to say a word....'R'.......ABOVE IT ALL ENOUGH SAID.

THANKS.....EVERYONE.....Ill be ok....just another fight,I'v got things to do.I WILL see all my grankids graduate from college.That is the name of the game!!!!!!!GOD BLESS YOU ALL!!!!!

I finally found some common ground with you Mike. Our family was a supporter of Cecil Andrus and my grandfather knew him, not closely, although Andrus always recognized him and called him by name. My grandfather was appointed to one of Andrus' commissions to encourage the sale of agricultural products to Idaho. My grandfather always spoke very highly of him.

That is a great goal lamont.

One of my brothers recently died of cancer. Our hearts are broken. His daughters are visiting for Spring Break and got here this morning. Through force of will he was able to live a lot longer than the doctors had predicted and we are all grateful for the extra time that his son and daughters had with him.

His son is in the Air Force, going overseas soon for a year.

Keep up the good fight! We are with you. And science is constantly learning new things in the fight against cancer. God be with you!

SHE'S AND AMERICAN, A REAL ONE !!!!!! I GOT TO TELL YOU I DO RESENT THE HECK OUT OF THAT.

I guess if your not ready to go to war and kill people your not a real American,i guess if your a person of color your not a real American.if you don't own a gun your not a real American.tell me what is a real American?????? Ever since her daddy stated she transferred a college because there were to many minorities there.... did she become a real American??......you have got to be kidding me !!!!!!!

A love affair with SARAH PALIN I guess will make you a real American??? No sober person on the right or the left other than for some form of nationalism takes this person seriously.I don't think she ever had America's best interest at heart because I DONT THINK SHE KNOWS WHAT IT IS.I ALSO TAKE ISSUE WITH HER BIGOTED PUNES.....I GUESS THAT IS A REAL AMERICAN.!!!!!!!!

Here is an example of a Sarah Palin comment.

"But with Obama deciding to just oh I guess lead from behind on this issue too, that's the community organizer in our president. That's a bit of that lackadaisical eh you know, don't have to take responsibility. His resume proves he hasn't had to responsibility for much in all these years. This just another issue, another example that falls in line with a community organizer."

According to politicususa:

"And by community organizer, Sarah Palin means black man.

The stereotype of the lackadaisical African-American goes back to slavery and Jim Crow. According to the 1937 book Class and Caste in a Southern Town, "It is a common error in judging lower class Negroes to compare them unfavorably with foreign immigrants, stressing the lackadaisical Negro work habits, and referring to the energy and zeal for advancement of a foreign peasantry."

http://www.politicususa.com/2013/06/29/racist-fox-news-rant-sarah-palin-calls-pr...

Good luck on your health Lamont. I know that is a tough struggle.

Palin's comment falls into number 1 of the 8 things for white people to consider. She is using the Jim Crow buzzwords like lackadaisical. Mike, if I were you, I would be embarrassed to sing her praises. On the other hand, you also use the "community organizer" phrase, like Palin does, a lot so maybe you are like Palin.

On the topic of the Loretta Lynch hearing delays the Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights is saying stop the delays now. There are some pretty good quotes regarding that in the link. Here is one.

"The Senate Republican majority is using every excuse it can find to delay or obstruct Lynch's confirmation. And the one thing these excuses all have in common is that none of them have anything to do with the nominee herself. We know that senators can walk and chew gum at the same time and that this is just the latest turn in what has been the most mishandled and manipulated confirmation process in memory." -- Wade Henderson, president and CEO of The Leadership Conference on Civil and Human Rights

http://www.civilrights.org/press/2015/african-american-leaders-loretta-lynch.htm...

MALTESE JOHNSON !!!!! Either this young man is very sincere or he is showing us how it is done.

when there investigation is done I would very much like to hear the reason for arresting someone because a zip code told to them didn't match the id given to you.What happened to asking for another or if you have another.I am ****** because the possibility of this young man having a criminal record for something so stupid seems to be just another way of giving a record to a black man.Now some might say I am jumping the gun and I could be, but when you really understand what happens and what they ck on a traffic stop you get were I am coming from.I am also saying he could have been wrong in his response and we shall have to see.The other thing is how did he wind up needing 21 stitches in his head???Are we getting to a point that we are now assaulting people under the pretext of and arrest,or are we provoking confrontations in order to assault who we arrest??

Now given the media goes after racial confrontations and we know this, how crediable is the reporting no matter who it favors ??? We are starting to have a problem that is snowballing !!! It will make it impossible for justice to be fair as much as it can be and yes there are questions there also ????Are people hiding behind race?? are the police hiding behind there badge?? do one or the other or both lie??? IT would seem to me things are getting worse. !!!

This young man is not some kid from the hood and he is smart as hell!!!! They may have a major problem on there hands.THOUGHTS !!!!!!

That is a shocking story. Unfortunately, they have a video only for after the student was bloodied and on the ground.

For those that may not have seen the Martese Johnson incident this is what is known.

1. He is a 20 year old honors student at UVA that went to a bar was asked for his ID which he showed but was turned away because he was under 21. That should have been the end of the story.

2. The bar person went out to the sidewalk and said that he/she thought that his ID was fake because the current zip code that he gave for his mother didn't match the zip code on the ID. -- That should have been the end of the story because he wasn't trying to enter the bar.

3. Then the Virginia alcohol police stepped in. We don't know what they said or he said but we do know that he didn't resist arrest because they charged him with "obstructing justice without force" and "public swearing and intoxication".

4. We do know that they slammed his face into the ground,bloodying his face. In response to this he was screaming at them, calling them a racist and that he was a UVA student and how could this be happening.

The Young Turks, provide a video and some balancing comments. One of them is that when you "have blood pouring down your face you are allowed to scream something."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOBUWd7xtGI&list=PLTpcK80irdQj-J_MP8cc4Uarwl71H5...

I forgot some key information. The ID was not fake.

This was what a third year college student at UVA that witnessed the incident said about the incident.

"Third-year College student Bryan Beaubrun, who said he witnessed the incident, said an ABC agent approached Johnson shortly after the bouncer at Trinity asked him to step aside after refusing to accept his ID.

"Martese was talking to the bouncer and there was some discrepancy about his ID," Beaubrun said. "[An] ABC officer approaches Martese and grabs him by the elbow...and pulls him to the side."

The arrest took place shortly thereafter, as Johnson was talking with a small group of ABC agents and Charlottesville police officers.

"It happened so quickly," Beaubrun said. "Out of nowhere I saw the two officers wrestling Martese to the ground. I was shocked that it escalated that quickly. Eventually [he was] on the ground, they're trying to put handcuffs on him and their knees were on his back."

This is what the Virginia Alcohol and Beverage Control (ABC) said.

"The uniformed ABC Agents observed and approached the individual after he was refused entry to a licensed establishment," the statement read. "A determination was made by the agents to further detain the individual based on their observations and further questioning. In the course of an arrest being made, the arrested individual sustained injuries. The individual received treatment for his injuries at a local hospital and was released."

So this is basically ABC agents that are mostly trying to stop underage drinking, which was already stopped when Johnson was refused entry to the bar, so they are dealing with kids. These guys think that you slam someone face down on a brick sidewalk is appropriate.

Audi, I watched the Young Turks video. They think that the ABC police would have thought twice about doing that to a white college student.

I got my information from the University of Virginia newspaper.

http://www.cavalierdaily.com/article/2015/03/university-student-honor-committee-...

TRUDY.....YOUR SECOND POST ON THE GUNFIGHT THE VIDEO WAS NOT THERE IT WAS THE WRONG ONE.

I WANT TO GET TO SEE IT !!!! I WONT BE HOME TOMORROW NIGHT I WILL BE PLAYING AT THE DRINK EARLY LIKE 7 PM SO I AM LOOKING TO SEE IT BEFORE I GET TO GOING !!!!!

Time to change the record Trudy.

TRUDY .....THANKS.....MY QUESTION WOULD BE WHY WASNT THAT GUY FACE DOWN AND WERE WAS THIS OFFICERS PARTNER TAKING HIS TIME GETTING THERE? I agree it's dangerous but I am really getting to the point that I am questioning training and attitude.Do we need to arrest at all cost, that we put ourselves in possible compromising situations??I don't call that good training at all.I compare it to the need that was recognized that high speed chases should be kept to a minumum and let technology do the chasing.Because of the property damage and the numbers of innocents that were being injured.I am glad the officer lived.I know what the gangsters will do to stay out of jail.

I am ok, we will be doing some testing Monday I think we have to be sure were its at I have had it removed from a leg and my colon so we have to find it and be sure.I have been opened up twice already.I am a pretty strong old man,i had my own construction company for a long time after retirement and I worked it with my people.I haVe been excersizing for the last few months.I have a will from hell once I make up my mind,I will see them graduate.But thanks for asking.I told you I HAVE TO PLAY THIS WEEKEND.I PLAY A HAMMOND ORGAN AND I travel with it,IT IS NOT SMALL.......SMILE

Trudy, any particular reason why you are calling Audi, Geordey and I ladies except that you THINK that it is an insult? You should have more respect for your gender.

As for what any of this blog "has a clue" on, you don't know what our knowledge and experience has included and currently includes. Also, we are not the topic of the blog.

Here is some more on the ABC agents incident with Martese Johnson.

It turns out that a few years ago, there was another incident with the ABC agents only this time there was sparkling water that they thought was beer. It was white women instead of a black man.

In that case, the agents started pounding on the car window after the women were in the car. The driver couldn't open the window because it was an electric window so she started the car in order to open the window. Then the agents started really pounding and crawling on the car. A woman in the backseat called 911. When the doors were open the woman talking to 911 told one of the agents that 911 wanted to talk with them. The agent was irritated but told 911 that yes they were really ABC agents.

Then they saw that the women didn't have beer. The women sued ABC which settled for $212,000. ABC said that they would provide more training in making sure that the ABC response was more appropriate to the suspected crime and that the ABC agents would wear body cameras. They weren't wearing them for the Martese agents.

These were white women and look what happened to them? It appears that the response quickly escalated to physical violence for a black man. So, when you have people with guns and a badge that aren't trained and aren't wearing body cameras, combined with racial prejudice then you have an honors student on the ground and bloodied.

Their was no sign that Johnson was intoxicated. The police didn't check.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2015/03/20/bloodied-uva-student-martese-jo...

SAM.....thanks for enlightening us about the previous incident with these ABC people.I had read about it but I didn't know how current it was.I am not sure wether race played a part in that incident.I have to agree that it makes you wonder why they weren't dragging people out the car if they thought they were leaving.Then you have to wonder if they had been black what would they have done.$250.000 dollars is some exspensive sparkling water.But in this case this person could have suffered life threatening injuries for the sake of a misdomenor ticket.The arrest was totally uncalled for IMO.

I have a bad feeling that there is and attempt in this country to make sure that every black male has and arrest record.And arrest record for this kid can affect the rest of his life,and make him a 2nd class citizen right out of school. I don't like what I am feeling but it is a real feeling.I also don't like the idea that blacks seem to be judge guilty and or at fault no matter what.We are forced to prove we are innocent.The blaming of the 12yr old TIMA RICE for his own death was way over the top.On the one hand we are told teach your children to trust the police on the other the police see the children as threats both now and in the future.That is a reciepe for disaster.The othere factor that plays here is how police talk to black folks. If how some people talk to me right here is and example for all to see then you know how people get provoked.I can tell you they speak to you in a very provoking condensending way, very disrespectfull !!!! I heard one here talking to and older black woman over 60, on a traffic stop it was unreal.I took her straight to the chief.She was so shook up she was shaking.

Yesterday a factor came out on someones program and this person was retired law enforcement and he said part of the problem there is NO standard training for law enforcement in the country every where does it there way.I could see where that could be part of the problem.WELL JUST SOME THOUGHTS GOT TO RUN FOR NOW.....

Good points lamont. I've come to have a really strong belief that police need to record every conversation with the public and wear body cameras. Then it will be like the study in Australia that when people know they are recorded that do know the correct way to behave and talk to people and being recorded reminds them that they do need to watch it.

Unfortunately, it doesn't cure the underlying racism, but it does help with re-enforcing whatever training that they might have had.

Trudy, once again I'd like to remind you that I am not the topic of the blog.

Sam. Slate.com had an article about the incident against the backdrop of the Univerisity of Virginia. It was called "A Quiet Tension". This school is said to be the only university that was built by slaves and that owned slaves. There are pockets of racial tensions caused by white privilege in housing and racial epitaphs.

On top of that the ABC for some reason has a lot of enforcement over underage drinking. And like you said nobody is wearing a body camera.

GEORDY.....THE abc MIGHT HAVE THAT KIND OF AUTHORITY THERE.Here for example one of the things bar owners complain about and I DID ALSO is the owner is held responsible for minors and are responsible for cking id BUT we are given no training on how to id a false one.THE RESULT IS YOU CAN GET SHUTDOWN BECAUSE SOMEONE IS CAUGHT IN YOUR PLACE WITH A FALSE ID although you ck'd.In most states a false ID has a penalty.I guess the zip code he told them didn't match what was on the id.I still don't find that to be and arrestable offense because the person who made out the id could have made that mistake, although you are held accountable to ck it and make sure it's correct.

I don't want to sterotype the south however we do know what is in some cases considered to be acceptable language in some circles.If you want to provoke it is simple, call a black man a boy he will more than likely react badly.Direct the n word at him and he will probally react violently.

The body camera's are a very good idea but they can turn them off.The deputy I went after the city for had turned his off and he had been warned because of a previous incident to keep it on.He doesn't work here anymore.I would rather have the body camera than nothing.

My dad was from that area and to be truthfull I never liked it there,attitudes.

TRUDY....before I wrote that answer I thought about all of that.I know it's not easy being a police officer !!!!!! I also know that caution is the better part of valor it saved my butt several times.But we have to call them as we see them and he did his job I am glad he didn't get killed.......later got some jazz to go play.....in boise

I found your article Geordey and it introduced an expression that I hadn't heard of: racial or gender microaggression. According to the author, we are going to hear more and more about this.

There are mixed feelings on the attention that this expression should get. The author had some examples, some of which were inadvertent. For example, it was not using the N-word, which is racist, but making an assumption that someone doesn't know as much because the person is black or a woman.

Some people have learned not to be racist, so the move to microaggression is an improvement but the next change for some to learn to handle better.

The author provided a simple definition of it. "Let's call it microaggression when people belittle us on the basis of stereotypes. Creating change requires at least making sense."

http://time.com/32618/microaggression-is-the-new-racism-on-campus/

I should have said, that I saw the expression microaggression in Geordey's article, and looked it up in the article from "Time." The author quoted was from the Time article.

TRUDY......I think the bigger question is why is this guy still on the job????tHAT LOOKS LIKE THE BUMBLE BEE HIWY no big deal call ahead !!!!!!! Potentially wreck a car, kill someone or cause and accident for a toll?????

Racism is clearly alive and well in the Fort Lauderdale police department.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/22/cops-fired-racist-video_n_6918652.html

The Fort Lauderdale post definitely shows racial bias from the police in that town. I have to wonder who hired him.

Back to your point about microaggression Sam. I, too hadn't heard of the expression so I looked it up in Psychology Today and found an article titled "Microaggressions: More than Just Race". This is what was said.

"Microaggressions are the everyday verbal, nonverbal, and environmental slights, snubs, or insults, whether intentional or unintentional, which communicate hostile, derogatory, or negative messages to target persons based solely upon their marginalized group membership. In many cases, these hidden messages may invalidate the group identity or experiential reality of target persons, demean them on a personal or group level, communicate they are lesser human beings, suggest they do not belong with the majority group, threaten and intimidate, or relegate them to inferior status and treatment."

It listed examples of it for race, gender, and sexual orientation. I cut and pasted the racial one here.

"Racial Microaggressions:

* A White man or woman clutches their purse or checks their wallet as a Black or Latino man approaches or passes them. (Hidden message: You and your group are criminals.).

* An Asian American, born and raised in the United States, is complimented for speaking "good English." (Hidden message: You are not a true American. You are a perpetual foreigner in your own country.)

* A Black couple is seated at a table in the restaurant next to the kitchen despite there being other empty and more desirable tables located at the front. (Hidden message: You are a second-class citizen and undeserving of first-class treatment.)"

Most interesting, or at least as equally interesting is what Psychology Today says that microaggression says about those guilty of it which is a lot of us.

"Racial, gender, and sexual orientation microaggressions are active manifestations and/or a reflection of our worldviews of inclusion/exclusion, superiority/inferiority, normality/abnormality, and desirability/undesirability. Microaggressions reflect the active manifestation of oppressive worldviews that create, foster, and enforce marginalization."

I've seen microaggressions on this blog many times. Here is an example.

"My perception is that you are females with desk jobs or homemakers and have no experience with police work. Some of your comments seem to me to indicate a lack of understanding regarding the type of physical confrontation Wilson and Brown engaged in. Many of your prior comments and the choice of topics you often gravitate to seem to indicate your gender is female." TrudySaidThis

Hey Audi. Can you post the link for the Psychology Today article? I'd like to read the whole thing.

Here you go.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/microaggressions-in-everyday-life/201011/mi...

SAM.......I was playing a gig last night and met two ladies who had just moved here from the east coast.They appeared to be a couple.They said the were driving coming out of meridian and were stoped by a cop.The white lady was driving,she said the officer didn't ask for her license or anything questioned her friend who was black,gave them a verbal warning and drove away.They said they meant to get his badge number and forgot.I am starting to wonder do you guys have a rogue officer down there or is this something in the force??I thought meridian used boise officers??I thought this incident would interest you.No I didn't know these people they were patrons who wanted to talk to me because of the band.I will probally see them again because they are from the east coast and exspressed the desire to hear our kind of music.One was definetly ex military and said so the other Im not sure......hope everything is fine I have been real busy but im here......smile

That is interesting lamont. It's like the policeman is just doing harassment under very specific circumstances. I hope it's just one guy and he gets stopped soon.

My son said that the policeman that stopped him was in Boise. I wonder if it could be the Idaho State Police which has the same people patrolling in Boise as in Meridian?

The not giving a ticket is a way for him to stay unidentified.

SAM......YOU ARE PROBALLY RIGHT, I HAD NOT THOUGHT OF THAT.......I can tell you if he stops me he will get identified !!!!!!!!!! first thing I ask for is badge number.

Lamont, did you hear the news about the South Caroline cop who did a traffic stop for a burnt out light on a 50 year old black man with no violent criminal history, and claimed that an incident occurred and he tazored the guy and it had no affect so the man took the tazor and ran so he shot him eight times in the back as he was running. He justified this because he said that he felt threatened. Sound familiar?

4 days went by and the authorities were buying the policeman's story but then a video showed up. It showed the suspect running away and the policeman shooting him, killing him. Then the policeman cuffed the man and then ran over and got his tazor and brought it back to the body and dropped it next to the body.

Now, different story. South Carolina is treating the case differently and charging the policeman with murder. THIS IS WHY THE POLICE NEED TO WEAR BODY CAMERAS AND BE ASSUMED TO BE GUILTY IF THEY AREN'T USING THEM.

SAM.......I SAW THE VIDEO !!!!!The naysers will say he shoudnt have run !!!!They will also say race had nothing to do with it !!!! along with soppose the officer had been black.??? I say here we go again.There was no attempt to chase this person this officer shot this person because he figured he would get away with it the only witness he thought was dead !!!!!This has been going on for years !!!! Most honest white people don't want believe it.They felt we were alibiing the criminals.We are all not criminals and sometimes you have people who act out there fantasie's and bigotry.wHAT IS UNREAL HERE IS YOU CANT BRING BACK THE DEAD.!!!! tHE VIDEO SPEAKS FOR ITSELF.We will have to wait and see what comes of this at least there out in front of it.