Romney And Ryan "Hood"---Good For Americans?

No Buckshot, they do not and that would be impossible (nobody agrees on everything). I do not like Romney but a strong VP candidate probably could have made the "bitter taste" less so. The items that I listed in my reasons for a "no" vote were very general---much larger issues than those above trouble me. Let me be really clear and state that I will not be casting a vote for Obama---EVER.

Also, I do vote and have since I was of age.

I would have voted for Cain too. Ryan is a solid choice, but I would have like to have seen what Rubio could have accomplished.

At least Ryan wants to get things done and not play store like the rest of them.

Romney-Ryan2012. It has a certain ring to it. And it shortens up well to R&Rin2012. But there are a few other "R" words that need to be considered in the next 80 plus days.

Realities -- as of August 9, 2012:

* the U. S. Government's total debt amounted to just over $50,658 per person or approximately $131,200 per household;

* A thirty year fixed mortgage in that amount at today's interest rates would cost over $562 per month, not including taxes and insurance.

* Unfunded liabilities owed by the U. S. Government amounted to over $364,000 per person or $942,948 per household;

* Those two total $1.07 Million for each household, not including any form of personal debt, such as credit cards, auto loans or mortgages;

* A thirty year fixed mortgage in that amount at today's interest rates would cost over $4,600 per month, not including taxes and insurance.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't know ANYBODY with that kind of pocket change.

Zook,

People who FEEl, don't usually understand.

I think Romney picked the wrong Paul..... He handed over the election to Obama when he picked his VP.

AWWW Buckshot I feel your pain! You have been dealt a disappointment!

Just incase you guys didn't realize it, that is actually a 6l and not a 61 at the end of Wayne's name.

And what do they say about assuming, Msm? :)

If I had looked closer then I wouldn't of assumed it was Buckshot. I didn't catch the l instead of the 1, I have a hole in my left eye in the retina so not making excuses but I don't see as well as others. When the hole goes all the way through I will loose my site in that eye and I will be done with the blogs....

Thanks, Warren. I didn't catch it until I started reading the post. Buckshot, while he likes to state his opinion like everyone else, doesn't come out to start trouble. It looked like this commentor was so, I knew something wasn't right.

Eye Buckshot not head, I will forgive you for that error.

Time will tell if Romney made the right decision.

I know the ad's will get ugly and the public I believe are getting tired of seeing them. I have stopped listening or watching ad's by the super pac's. I'm anxiously awaiting the debates, that's where the proof is, and where many American Citizen's will make their choice...

ZOOK.....give the budget thing a rest.....budgets have been submitted........congress and senate never voted on them......lay the blame were it belongs.

SEEMS as though last week we had and israelie I belive NETANYAHU SAID THAT this administration had done more for israel than any administration before it.I think they know we have there back.

AS a senior, cong RYAN.s so called solutions do not set well with me so now that he is out in the open we shall see what he is really about.

The garbage throwing is by no means one sided so dont even try to say it is.THAT "paid clown" was pretty well vetted by all that include fox news and GOV ROMNEY controlled BAIN longer than he stated, the documents prove that.

I must have missed something yesterday and sat because I was playing in sunvalley,but no matter.........

It looks as though the No votes were prior to some of the other issues that came along.

I like the fact that he is Pro-Life.

The other thing that has all of us scratching our heads is why can't they "streamline" the day to day operations of running the Govt first? By this I mean cut out the obvious waste. Then move on to entitlement programs and other buget issues.

All of us can manage that ourselves. But in order to create some type of political conflict aided by the media, we find that they pull out the obvious "hot" issues first. Guaranteed to start fist-fights and tug-a-wars. then no one gets anywhere.

Maybe if we insist that they use their vacation days to campaign or take pay cuts on the days that they are not in session, it would start to hurt them a little bit.

But the biggest elephant in the room is no one is going to get anything if we don't get this straightened out right now. Common sense is not in great supply with our elected officials.

Paul Ryan is at least up front as to where he stands on trying to make a budget.

KH, I agree with you on most points.

It's not about what they can do for our Country any more. It's all about the money.

Our Country can be sold to the highest bidder!

OMG...I agree with MsM re: her post of today at 11:47 on my blog.

Why can we just not have an honest, "regular" candidate that has the best interests of this country and its people at heart? None of these people have ANY idea what it is like to choose to eat or pay the electric bill. Or to pay the mortgage or make the car payment. Or to eat or pay a health insurance premium. Or to put gas in the car or obtain much needed medication (medication from a doctor with a valid RX that is). Not one of these people has ANY clue. And we look to the "silver spoons" to balance a budget, etc.? Does anyone else see the irony in this? These people make their money BREAKING the middle class. The worse off we are, the richer they get. That is the problem. It is not in THEIR best interests to improve things.

haven't we all made some decisions in the past that weren't all that inspired only to regret them later.

What I admire most is that Ryan did not back down from his budget.

We all have to change the way that we think as a nation. No more free rides for anybody. I mean from the top down. We start at the top and remove the frosting first then we deal with the entitlements.

Why should someone who has a large retirement pkg. draw Social Security? It was meant for those who wouldn't have a pension otherwise. It was supposed to be voluntary too.

When you can identify who is double dipping, their is your first cut. No more parties or trips until everything gets audited and some reasonable cuts are made.

How do we get someone's attention? Voting and/or changing our own lifestyle.

Ironically, Emanual Cleaver sent me an e-mail message asking for civility in our conversation. This from the guy who cheated KC constituients as mayor and "made" up a story about tea party members spitting on him. He vacationed on our dime with his family.

I hope that he is afraid. He certainly didn't listen to his voters when it came to Obamacare.

OM,

"Not one of these people has ANY clue. And we look to the "silver spoons" to balance a budget, etc.? Does anyone else see the irony in this? These people make their money BREAKING the middle class. The worse off we are, the richer they get. That is the problem. It is not in THEIR best interests to improve things."

Common ground....

OM, I see you're joining the "class warfare" crowd. The "silver spoons" as you call it, got rich and successful precisely because they could balance their budgets. Succesful entrepreneurs, not government bureaucrats like Obama who has never held a job in the private sector, are exactly the people we need to run our country. Government needs to be run like a business. If a business were to incur the kind of debt our government has, it would fold. We've had enough of the lawyers and bureaucrats running this country. It's time for a real change - not only in people in charge but also a change in philososphy.

BUCKSHOT......CITE THE EXAMPLES OF RACIAL WARFARE.......I STATED VERY CLEARLY THAT RACIAL WAREFARE AND CLASS WARFARE ARE NOT THE SAME.You see things your way I see them mine.Dont tell me I dont want to. You dont know me, you are making and assumption, that's not a good idea.

ZOOK......I did not make that statment the ISRAELI prime minister did.LIKE you I am taking him at his word.Straight out of his mouth.

I don't think that we should offer aid to a country that is threating to wipe out another country, or has humanitarian violations, whose leaders are dictators who subjugate their people. That's the problem with Washington - TOO MANY UNPRINCIPLED PEOPLE WHO THINK LIKE POLITICIANS.

THANKS BUCKSHOT..... LIKE I SAID YOU SEE THINGS ONE WAY I SEE THEM ANOTHER........first comment would be real and honest observation based on the society's classification of blacks.iI would never say he didnt hear what Wright had to say what you fail to consider which I think he considered was Wright's frame of refernce.....you would probally like to say that what Wright feels and said where unjustified, as someone who went through what Wright did I understand that anger,You were not there you have no idea although I have tried,to know what it was like to be spat at twice,once for the uniform and second for being black.That feeling never goes away.SOME of us just let it ebb but it will always be there,but you move on and try to make a better world......yes he heard him.His thoughtless rehetoric yes,and it wasnt about white folks in general it was a racist remark made about people in certain areas....I can take you to places in the south were they live to ensure that I am made to feel less than AND THEY CLING TO THERE GUNS AND BIBLES TO JUSTIFY IT.I dont know what THE PRES assumed but I do know the officer assumed that PROF Gates could not be living in that neigbehood,IT HAPPENS ALL THE TIME EVEN TODAY.I THINK GATES REACTED BADILY.......I think he thought he was above what happened to him.His reaction got the action that happened and I do consider Gates the provoker.The MARTIN COMMENT WAS MUCH ADO ABOUT NOTHING. FOR THOSE WHO WERE LOOKING FOR SOMETHING TO POINT AT THEY GOT IT.THERE WAS NO INTENT TO DIVIDE.

IT appears to me that when it is convenient he is the Black president when it's not we want him to forget it and say all inclusives things when it has been clear that his being elected was in no way inclusive to some.

AGAIN DO YOURSELF A FAVOR .....DONT tell me what will register I get sick of you trying to insult my integrity,intelligence and anything else you can find.

I do not find the president to be anymore racist than I percieve you are. sO LIKE I SAID YOU SEE THINGS YOUR WAY I SEE THEM MINE.

SEEM TO me when he speaks he speaks with the terms us,we,AMERICANS,THE COUNTRY EXCETRA.HAVN'T HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT EXCLUDING EVERYBODY BUT BLACK FOLKS,OR INCLUDING ONLY BLACK FOLKS. You need to remeber that the society labeled him because the question should be is the glass half full or half empty so I might see him as a white person.......did you ever think about that???I WONDER IF ANY OF THIS WILL REGISTER WITH YOU!!!!!!

Econ101 - 1967

When your outgo exceeds your income,

Your upkeep becomes your downfall.

BUCKSHOT.....YOU CAN TWIST MY WORDS IF YOU WANT.....I didnt defend WRIGHT I said I UNDERSTAND HIS ANGER THERE IS A DIFFERENCE. I am not going to say what you think I should say.IF you really read what I wrote I SAID OBAMA had made some racist remarks or did you just gloss over that because I was not standing and screaming he was a racist.Ill say it again I DONT CINSIDER HIM ANY MORE OF A RACIST THAN I consider you one.I am not going to have this silly argument you will twist everything and not deal with what was said.I WILL SAY THIS for some like you BUCKSHOT IF A BLACK PERSON DOESNT SING AS YOU PERCIEVE THEY SHOULD THEN THEY ARE WRONG,THEY ARE MARXIST,THEY ARE LOOKING FOR REVOLUTION,AND I COULD GO ON.........I DONT SEE THE WORLD AS YOU SEE IT.AND YOU DONT SEE IT AS I DO.BUT I DO TRY TO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOURS IS ABOUT ......YOU MAKE NO EFFORT TO PERCIEVE WHAT MINE IS ABOUT AND HAS BEEN ABOUT..........SO with that said ,you can see wright anyway you want you can also see the PRESIDENT any way you want.I VENTURE TO SAY THAT YOU PROBALY DONT HAVE MUCH RESPECT FOR ANYONE OF COLOR.THAT doesnt make you a racist it does speak to intolerance and a BLINDNESS TO the actions of some and a condemnation of the actions of others.

We didnt have any sandinista in my neigbehood AND CERTAINLY NOT IN MY CHURCH ,MAYBE THEY DO TODAY.LIKE it or not REV WRIGHT spoke some truths you might not have wanted to hear.Since when did whats happening in AFRICA play in AMERICA??? that is a stretch nice try.

LAST......I didnt say this was about OBAMA COLOR. I said show me where he has promoted racial warfare.YOU HAVNT DONE THAT, you went off in another direction.You have attempted to nullify and put down every black leader that has been mentioned on this blog, why is that??AND THAT INCLUDES THE CONSERVATIVE ONES ALSO.SOMETHING else you need to get straight,I AM NOT A VERY EMOTIONAL PERSON TAKE THAT STEROTYPE AND SHOVE IT......IF I ever blindly attack through emotions you will know it......I WONT BE ON THIS BLOG ANYMORE.......HAVE A GOOD DAY TRY AND GIVE THE RESPECT YOU GET.

So you want to "get rid of them all" by sending this yahoos to the White House. If they are currently in Congress---they are ALREADY part of the problem.

They are all bad. The only choice is bad or worse. Very sad.

And for all of you vets out there who are rah rah for Ryan---look at the cuts he wants to make, along with Romney to your benefits. That is an eye opener.

Please elaborate.OM....ON. the vets.... I would appreciate it dearly....

http://www.disabledveterans.org/2012/06/...

Lamont, the above is a brief summary of part of it. If you Google it, you will find a bunch of information. Look at his voting history as well which has been posted here. There is a bunch of info on what R & R have as their vision for America.

It is disgusting that benefits of those who served would be cut like this. It is also disgusting that we treat seniors the way we do. If we really want to turn things around we need to really cut welfare programs and get the "scammers" and "cheats" off social security. No more 6 generations on welfare (Medicaid, welfare, subsidized housing, food stamps). If you need help for 6-12 months, so be it BUT A LIFETIME?!?!?!? Please!

I do not know what the answers to this mess are but what we are doing and the people we have doing it are NOT the answer. That is pretty clear.

Now for those who will say that Ryan and Romney plan to cut welfare, etc., that IS true. However, they also plan to tax the heck out of the middle class and cut the funds available for education. But hey, no taxes on capital gains, interest, inheritance, etc. So, the rich get richer. Great plan.

OM, I would ask that you go back and re-read Buckshot's first post on your blog. We're not all going to agree on what cuts R and R are proposing - or even if their budget proposals will ever get approved. They have to be careful about cutting too much from the military or VA benefits in a time of all-volunteer military. I'm sure they know this. We all know that drastic cuts will need to be made in all areas or this country will go bankrupt just like the European countries. We've seen what the Obama regime has done to this country. Let's get behind Romney and Ryan and give them a chance to try and undue some of the mess. Right now, we have no other choice.

Are we getting way ahead of ourselves with all of this talk about the Romney/Ryan ticket and the platform that they are going to be running on? There is plenty of evidence that the two don't agree point for point on many of the budget line items. But lest we forget, the RNC and campaign committees are behind closed doors somewhere pounding out what they think will have the best chance of getting their people into the White House. It's called marketing.

It is still a couple of weeks before the conventions and until they are finished, we are chasing windmills.

NICE TRY BUCKSHOT......BUT NO CIGAR.......STUCK YOUR FINGERS IN AVOIDED QUESTION AND BURNED YOURSELF, TO BAD....NO MORE THAN YOU ARE...

OM thankyou I am digging further

Not really good points from Twil. These people make a great deal of money from interest. They also inherit MILLIONS and MILLIONS from wealthy family members (most are from old money). So to say that they make little from such areas is not accurate. The "little" adds up. They also buy and sell homes and vacation homes like you and I change our socks.

So now we find other ways for them to pay less because they are the wealthy. Zook---it shocks me that you are backing all of this crap when it is the middle class that will float all of this crap.

It further floors me that "we will not worry about it till it happens." Look at how these people---ALL OF THEM---vote! It is already happening. We do not need ANY of these jokers to win another election as their grand plan is already in motion.

Lamont, you do respond with emotion with each and every post you blast out with CAPS LOCK on. What you write (and it has been said over and over) would be better received if you just typed. Nobody likes to be screamed at. Caps lock should be used for emphasis not to scream at people day after day. And for the record, Obama really does not like the "white" race---he is pretty clear about that as evidenced by statements in his book and his history around IL and just how and what he says. He does not even like or support the American people. To deny that is not being very truthful, IMHO.

Buckshot, spot on as always re: Obama. Gotta love our "choices."

OM.......When people any person writes a book they reflect on things as they were when they grew up etc.I find it funny that I get people right here who tell me what happened to you then was then this is now.OK so as he felt then the feelings of a child growing without one parent and being identified with that parent rather than the parent who is raising them.That kind of feelings are normal.As the child grows and is exsposed to other things those feeling change.Now i have grandchildren 2 generations removed from OBAMA and still when they tell some..... that's my granpa some will say to them he cant be your granpa.......some people wont say anything except ok.Point being a childs perception is there I wonder if you could imagine that feeling of confusion daily during your youth,and now that he reflects honestly about it in a book we want to label him today.....This is the double standard we talk about.....If he did not support the American people he would not have done the stimulus,or healthcare,or the banks,they were the hard choices.IF he hated white people he would not have treated his granmother with such respect.

I wonder is the only way some feel that a person likes them is when you are smiling in there face no matter what they do or say to you?? Just as you feel dislike of me am I not entitled to dislike you??or is only your dislike justified.You as and individual have done nothing to me but you dislike based on your frame of reference.IF I used that narrow critera I could dislike a lot of white people.

I think there is a difference,in how you percieve what is being said and the context.I grew up with the MALCOLM x'S FARAHKHANS,,HUEY LEWIS AND BLACK PANTHERS AND A HOST OF OTHERS ,we understood there anger but we didnt fall into the trap of hate.For some reason I get the impression that you hold these people or people like them as the norm in the black community they are not.They served a pupose like everyone and everything does at there time and place.

This President does not hate whites nor does he hate AMERICA AND TO ACT AS THOUGH HE DOES BECAUSE HE DOESNT DO AS YOU WANT IS TO DO HIM AND YOURSELF A GRAVE DISERVICE.He is not trying to do anything detrimental to the country.I dont think everything he has done is the best but I dont think that is the intent. The black community knew that to be the same as he was going to have to be better than for it to be right.It was a given.Dont think by any stretch of the imagination that he has pleased a large group of us ,he has not.That pertains to leadership as a whole not how it affects blacks.

IF there was a major failure here there are things to be considered,the amount of crazy accusations have been of the charts,kids make a song and somehow that was indoctrination and not simply a celebration made no sense.birth certificate,etc these things accomplished one thing that was to marginalize this man.How can a leader function when the part of the leadership apperatus states from day one.We are here to ensure you fail.

Anyhow from some view points we ask what could be if you could get some cooperation from some on the otherside??? This has been frustrating to watch.AND THIS IS NOT ALL ABOUT POLICEY I think some say that to make themselfs feel good.When the man can take the idea you put out and the moment he endorses it you turn180 you know whats going on.Has he made mistakes??YOU BET. will he make more ,YOU BET.Given what he had to work with and the resistance he faced he did ok.

LAST TIME I am not a typist if you take offense because of the way I TYPE SORRY .......ME I am glad I am here to type........MATTER OF PRIORITIES..........so what I am saying in the whole big scheme of things why does it count on a blog?????? THERE ARE BIGGER THINGS TO BE CONCERNED ABOUT,..........LATER

OM,

"These people make a great deal of money from interest. They also inherit MILLIONS and MILLIONS from wealthy family members (most are from old money). So to say that they make little from such areas is not accurate. The "little" adds up. They also buy and sell homes and vacation homes like you and I change our socks."

The first sentence differs from what I wrote in what way? Buying and selling of homes is classified as capital gains by the financial world. Again, so where is the difference?

Back to the topic,

This trend of focusing more on mud slinging and nasty political ads is unbecoming of America.

MH resident.......do me a favor dont try to dog whistle me.The paste job you post conviently leaves out a very pertinent fact. You want something to change that you took over 200 yrs ingraining to turn around in 50yrs.YOUR MANEFEISTO GETS ALL UPSET ABOUT WHAT YOU SEE AS REVERSE DISCRIMINATION. Where were you when it was plain discrimination.Because what you posted basically says that was OK.to BAD THE MEDIA DOES NOT EVER FOCUS ON THE BLACK COMMUNITY's that are as middle class as it's white counterparts.SO when you finally recognize that, if you can? that THE COMMUNITY IS NO DIFFERENT THAN ANY OTHER.

AND if you knew anything about black history you would know that AFRICA HAS NOT ALWAYS BEEN AS IT IS NOW. I could argue everything in that post but if you sort to post it I would have to think you believe it so I wont bother.....I HAVE A BLOG NAME ,,,,,,,,USE IT

(copied and Pasted) Questionable?

Buchanan has written about the Holocaust and engaged in the defense of some accused of Nazi war crimes. For example, Buchanan wrote that it was impossible for 850,000 Jews to be killed by diesel exhaust fed into the gas chamber at Treblinka.

These kind of statements have led to accusations that he has helped legitimize Holocaust denial. When George Will challenged him about it on TV, Buchanan failed to reply. In 1983 he criticized the U.S. Government for expressing regret over its postwar protection of Klaus Barbie.

In 1985, Buchanan advocated restoring the citizenship of Arthur Rudolph, an ex-Nazi rocket scientist accused of employing slave labor at a V-2 plant. In 1987, Buchanan lobbied to stop deportation of Karl Linnas, accused of atrocities in Estonia. In 1991 William F. Buckley, Jr. wrote a 40,000-word National Review article discussing anti-Semitism amongst conservative commentators focused largely on Buchanan; the article and many responses to it were collected in the book In Search of Anti-Semitism (1992). He concluded: "I find it impossible to defend Pat Buchanan against the charge that what he did and said during the period under examination amounted to anti-Semitism." The Anti-Defamation League has called Buchanan an "unrepentant bigot" who "repeatedly demonizes Jews and minorities and openly affiliates with white supremacists." Neo-conservative columnist Charles Krauthammer said about Buchanan that "There's no doubt he makes subliminal appeals to prejudice." Buchanan has adamantly denied that he is antisemitic, and a number of conservatives and his journalistic colleagues, some of them Jewish, including Jack Germond, Al Hunt, and Mark Shields, have defended him against the charge.

He has also wrote a book that got him fired from MSNBC.

The book, which contained chapters titled "The End of White America" and "The Death of Christian America," was blasted by critics as homophobic, anti-Semitic and racist.

You be the Judge

MH MH RESIDENT........The history I was speaking of is way before anything in the 20th century or the 19th century.BUT it matters NOT. you CAN JUSTIFY all you want I dont identify as anything but and AMERICAN.I can tell you this what you see on TV is A LIE and if you believe that the majority of blacks in this country are what is depicted on TV THEN YOU ARE A FOOL. I can find fault with anything if I want to,depending on how and what I use as a measurment.IS there something wrong with ms M pointing out that your source has been more than accused of bigotry to any number of groups??? So mh resident if you subscribe to that thinking were does that leave you???HOW DID SHE DECIEVE,OR DEFLECT??.SOunds like that age old ........he must have done something.......you know how they are........I have a question when is it going to stop????? OR is it ok with you that people get falsly accussed,given arrest records for no reason,murdered in the hands of law enforcement,it's ok just as long as it's them........and you want to know why this continues?????? NOT SO HARD TO SEE IF YOU WANT TO SEE IT.

When the PRESident encourages some one to use bodily harm to get what you want or incites with the intent to forcibly change something then and only then will I accept the premise of racial warfare.Until then I will not accept the premise that he is proposing racial warefare.That is what some would like to say to suit there own agenda.It certainly is NOT part of the black community"s agenda.I am for the most part done with this it is a waste of my time.I think you want and need and enemy,been there done that, can do again if need be, would rather not.

Historically, it is known that the Nazis tried several methods in killing the Jewish People. One of them was the Diesel Fumes. It was too slow and not as effective as the gas that they eventually settled on.

So MSM: he was probably saying that the estimate of 850,000 people being exterminated by Diesel was not accurate. The experiment was short lived.

I think in your zeal to paint him as a bigot, you failed to see some of the history. Our government aided and abetted many Nazi War Criminals at the end of WWII. Klaus Barbie should never have been allowed to live after to war. There is where his contention lay. I suggest that you read up a little more about the Holocaust. It is a known fact that Jewish People in the US who had the ear of FDR failed to save many of the Jews in camps. For fear of some sort of reprisal in the US.

In fact, there were many who turned a blind eye to what went on in those camps.

Are they bigots too?

Being fired from MSNBC would not be a great loss in my opinion.

Having an opinion about minorities does not make you a bigot. A bigot is someone who lets themselves think that someone is less than human.

Zook

You exspressed it better than I did. I am getting tired of the words, hate, racist, bigot,radical and phobic.

What I am phobic about is other people denying my right to choose. If I choose to make a stand on some issue, it is my right to do so. As long as I don't make it personal and name names. I don't tell anyone where they are going if they disagree with me. (Some people do and I think that it's wrong).

I take each person as they come along regardless of race or religion. What I won't take is someone questioning my common sense about those who have absolutely no repect for human life, not even their own children or relatives.

Collateral Damage has been the norm too long. Anyone who does not hesitate to blow up innocent individuals including themeselves, is a danger and should be regarded as so.

The media seems to pick and choose collateral damage in their coverage. I include all networks on this.

The war against women is simply this, If you are a conservative, you are fair game. No one will speak up for you. If you are whining about birth control and personal medical treatment, you are being discriminated against. And Gloria Allred will be happy to represent you.

When a woman "chooses" to take an action that results in a preganancy or contracts a disease of a certain nature. Her right to choose has already been made. The next choice involves another individual.

Choices always have consequences. Sometimes you only hurt yourself, but most of the time, it has a ripple effect and last more than the "wonderful" moment that you just experienced.

I will continue to respectfully disagree on all the issues and I will not expect you to come over to my side of thinking.

I asked my husband about Patrick Buchanan and he says that he is considered an Idealogue. Some of his statements do not jive with my own personal opinions, but I still will not call him a bigot.

The bigots are those who stand at the entrance to a voting booth and harrangue voters. The bigots are those who refuse to prosecute those who break the laws because of race.

KH GAL........I hope your definition of a bigot covers everyone because there are a lot of them out there on both sides.NEEDLESS to say yours rings of a political bias,based on a very publicised event.SO I hope that the secretary of state in PA counts in that number.He does fit your criteria.

So Biden does not remember where he is and Ryan is unable to remember asking for "welfare" from a program he did not support. If you can't beat em---join em I guess.

This is all very sad. We may have what we have as far as "choices" and I understand that but at least lie about things that "matter"...like taxes, affairs, number of children, etc.

KH GAL.......I wasnt talking anything about slavery at all.I was talking about the last 2 sentences in your post on the 16th at 1130.REPARATIONS WHERE DID THAT COME FROM??? the only thing I have harped on is the continuence of discriminatory treatment in deed and word that some seem to find ok.I dont remember you as a person saying anything that would give me the impression you condoned that.

I am well traveled and believe me I am aware of what goes on in other countrie's.I have a lot of feelings about it but I have always felt we need to get our own house in order before we preach to the world.I love my country and would die for her if need be, but I am also aware of her faults. You have never heard me say anyone was owed anything.OUR people all Americans have a right to free unfettered access to life liberty and the pursuit of happines without fear that they will be discrimnated against for any reason.That is what I am about anything less is unacceptable to me.I am a proponet of hard work and sacrifice and with that you progress on your own.IT is hard enough to succeed without somone putting up roadblocks.I would think that you get where I am comming from.I stayed in idaho because I had some very kind things happen to me that the people who did them had no idea the impression they made and believe me I have never forgotten that.Those folks far outwiegh some of the bigotry I hear and see today.THEY were a model on what should be and I try to be just as giving in every way I can........hope you have a good day.

Lamont

I was on a roll the other day. Many things come up with all of these issues. So some of my blathering was more observations of what we as a nation keep getting bombarded with.

For Every Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson in this world who want to keep the angst going for things that have happened in the past, there are others who have pulled their bootstraps up and gotten on with their lives. They don't depend on the 5:00 news to keep their egos stoked.

I had to pull my own up at the age of 26 when I became a single mother with two small children. I didn't have a dime to my name or a place to live. I packed what I had room for in a car and started off to a completely strange place to create a new life for myself and my kids. I have been on food stamps and welfare. I didn't stay there, I eventually healed and was able to get a job. It wasn't easy.

The Government will gladly fund any type of seminar available for you to attend and provide babysitting. But If you try to get a job, they don't answer your calls.

I was fortunate, I had good friends by then and was able to get back on my feet. Some people never see a way out.

Instead of throwing money at all of these issues, common sense should prevail. Invest 6 mos or a year to a family to provide them the support that they need. This would include job training, childcare and other financial support.

I never judge someone who is purchasing groceries on food stamps. I happen to know that we have the same food cravings as anyone else. Or that sometimes we want to provide a time to entertain and this is the only contribution that we can give.

When you take on the highest office of the Nation, you can blame the previous administration for your own job performance for just so long. If the cook left all the dirty dishes in the kitchen for you to clean up. Well, you roll up your shirtsleeves and get to cleaning.

I am not really as political as you think. I am view this problem as a whole about the failure of our elected officials to do their job. Our only expectation is that they Keep on the task at hand, just as we the other Americans keep on doing.

I believe that it isn't an election that will turn things around, but people humbling themselves and praying a little harder for each other.

We in our personal lives have made ourselves slaves to "having it all". Now the bill has come due and no one is coming forward with a bag of money.

IT'S NOT WORKING FAST ENOUGH !!!!!!!!! ROMNEY'S PLAN IS WARMED OVER GEORGE BUSH....... DONT KNOW WHICH WAY TO GO ECONOMICALLY....... there is a lot to think about.

Zook......tHE president did not give out any guidlines,the states asked for more leeway in that area and they gave it to them.IF you have a problem with it,know that they asked for this before and didnt get it.So direct that at the states.

BUCKSHOT.......some have worked some have not,and with the impatience of The AMERICAN it's a wonder that anything that doesnt happen over night is considered getting done.The moment I say something you consider DEFENDING you jump though hoops.I am a pretty fair person and I am not into trashing people just because I dont like there political persuasion.MAYBE a fairer question would be.....considering the economic shape the country was in in 2008 did he do the job of keeping us out of a depression?? ....BUT that would be a fair question and we know based on your feelings about liberals that no matter the answer it would be wrong.

I DONT care for GOV ROMNEY but I am not on here trashing him at every turn.And I have a lot of reason's to trash him.I said what I said about him before.......so to put it more bluntly FOR me he is a robber BARON,part of and elite group of people who are about MONEY AT ALL COST AS A MEASURE OF SUCCESS.HE neither knows about the middle class nor cares .I think he see's us as a means to and end that is all.ZOOK CAN PUT IN ALL KINDS OF WORDS it matters not because when they sit and tell baldface lie's I havnt heard one word calling them out for it.IT'S ok I know it makes you guys feel good.ROMNEY AND RYAN ARE NOT THE ANSWER... IF YOUR ABOUT COUNTRY.IF your about money they probally are for you, problem being they are not there to see that you are part off.KNOWING how they see you I can only imagine how they see me.You have your priority's and I have mine ROMNEY /RYAN DO NOTHING FOR ME......THAT'S MY OPINION IT'S MINE YOU HAVE YOURS I AM SURE........youll notice I didnt make comparisons..so when you comeback try to refrain from that,I am not here to argue on a personal level......

Yeah, those billions and billions in Obama stimulus sure have made all the difference. Money well spent. Obamacare is just the cherry on top now!

A while back someone posted some Obama Jokes.

Below is a list of Romney Quotes not jokes but Quotes Romney has said.

Enjoy (copied and pasted)

1. "Corporations are people, my friend... of course they are. Everything corporations earn ultimately goes to the people. Where do you think it goes? Whose pockets? Whose pockets? People's pockets. Human beings, my friend." --Mitt Romney to a heckler at the Iowa State Fair who suggested that taxes should be raised on corporations as part of balancing the budget (August 2011)

2. "I like being able to fire people who provide services to me." --Mitt Romney, using an unfortunate choice of words while advocating for consumer choice in health insurance plans (January 2012)

3. "I'm not concerned about the very poor. We have a safety net there." --Mitt Romney (January 2012)

4. "He [Obama] says we need more firemen, more policemen, more teachers. Did he not get the message of Wisconsin? The American people did. It's time for us to cut back on government and help the American people." --Mitt Romney at a campaign event in Council Bluffs, Iowa, June 8, 2012

5. "I'll take a lot of credit for the fact that this industry's come back." --Mitt Romney, --Mitt Romney, on the American auto industry, despite having written a New York Times op-ed in 2008 titled "Let Detroit Go Bankrupt," in which he said if GM, Ford and Chrysler got a government bailout "you can kiss the American automotive industry goodbye"

6. "It's hard to know just how well [the 2012 London Olympics] will turn out. There are a few things that were disconcerting. The stories about the private security firm not having enough people, the supposed strike of the immigration and customs officials, that obviously is not something which is encouraging." --Mitt Romney, insulting Britain on the eve of the Olympics by suggesting the country is not ready, NBC News interview, July 25, 2012

7. "I'll tell you what, ten-thousand bucks? $10,000 bet?" --Mitt Romney, attempting to make a wager with Rick Perry during a Republican presidential debate to settle a disagreement about health care (December 2011)

8. "I should tell my story. I'm also unemployed." --Mitt Romney, speaking in 2011 to unemployed people in Florida. Romney's net worth is over $200 million.

9. "[My wife] drives a couple of Cadillacs." --Mitt Romney, campaigning for president in Michigan (February 2012)

10. "I believe in an America where millions of Americans believe in an America that's the America millions of Americans believe in. That's the America I love." --Mitt Romney (January 2012)

Bonus Quotes:

"Join me in welcoming the next president of the United States, Paul Ryan." --Mitt Romney, committing a gaffe while introducing his running mate, Norfolk, Va., Aug. 11, 2012

"PETA is not happy that my dog likes fresh air." --Mitt Romney in 2007, responding to criticism from People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals following revelations that he had once put the family dog in a carrier and strapped it to the roof of his car during a 12-hour road trip

"I have some friends who are NASCAR team owners." --Mitt Romney, after being asked whether he follows NASCAR racing (February 2012)

"There were a couple of times I wondered whether I was going to get a pink slip" --Mitt Romney, attempting to identify with the problems of average folk (January 2012)

"I'm not sure about these cookies. They don't look like you made them. No, no. They came from the local 7/11 bakery, or whatever." --Mitt Romney, visiting a local bakery while campaigning in Pittsburgh, PA, April 17, 2012 (The owner of the baker later told MSNBC he was offended by Romney's remarks.)

"I like those fancy raincoats you bought. Really sprung for the big bucks." --Mitt Romney to a group of NASCAR fans wearing plastic ponchos at the Daytona 500 (February 2012)

"We have a president, who I think is is a nice guy, but he spent too much time at Harvard, perhaps." --Mitt Romney, who has two Harvard degrees (April 5, 2012)

"I love this state. The trees are the right height." --Mitt Romney, campaigning in Michigan (February 2012)

"I'm running for office for Pete's sake, we can't have illegals" --Mitt Romney, recalling his reaction when he learned that there were illegal aliens working the ground on his property, employed by a firm that he subsequently fired (October 2011)

"I get speaker's fees from time to time, but not very much." --Mitt Romney, who earned $374,000 in speaking fees in one year according to according to his personal financial disclosure (January 2012)

"It's not worth moving heaven and earth, spending billions of dollars just trying to catch one person." --Mitt Romney, speaking in 2007 about killing Osama bin Laden

"Who let the dogs out? Who, who." --Mitt Romney, during an awkward photo op with a group of African Americans kids at a Martin Luther King Day parade (January 2008)

"I'm Wolf Blitzer and yes, that's my real name." --CNN's Wolf Blitzer at the beginning of a November 2011 Republican presidential debate

"I'm Mitt Romney--and yes Wolf, that's also my first name." --Mitt Romney, getting his own name wrong (his first name is "Willard," and his middle name is "Mitt")

"I'm not familiar precisely with what I said, but I'll stand by what I said, whatever it was." --Mitt Romney (May 17, 2012)

Im not worried aboput anything if you have the need to attempt to project that go right ahead.AGAIN THE BLOG IS FOR OPINIONS YOU ARE TRYING TO TAKE IT ELSEWERE.I have given links I have also stated where my info came from,but why bother.I make assumptions that what you post is yours this is not a court of law or is it for you? Hold your self accountable to yourself that will do and dont try to hold others accountable over which you have no authority.Try it.Nobody here answers to you that is what you have been trying to do to the blog since you got here.IT has worked on some it wont on me.

The only person I mentioned was zook and I am sure if he had a problem he would have stated it.Why dont YOU just say I dont want any liberals or liberal statements on the blog.WE SHALL SEE WHAT THAT WILL GET YOU< in the mean time I will post were, when, and how I please.I am not insulting anyone nor am I attacking anyone.Dont like what I post dont answer. I assure you I dont answer to you nor will I ever.

I didnt read your article buckshot I take the stand it is the same old party line so why bother.just BECAUSE YOU POSTED IT DOESNT MAKE IT REQUIRED READING.and that's the point.......have a great day.

"The Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) reported just last month that the U.S. average weekly wage declined nearly 2% percent between the fourth quarter of 2010 and the fourth quarter of 2011. This is only the fifth time wages have declined in the past 33 years."

"Succinctly stated, we have shrinking income, inflation in energy and food "skyrocketing" (just like Obama predicted four years ago), a weaker dollar, a ballooning debt, and a national security-risking deficit. The costs of all this "hope and change" are landing squarely on the back of the middle class."

"A strong middle class equals a strong America. We can't have one without the other. And our current policies are killing both. So don't listen to Obama's rhetoric; for it rings hollow. Look at his actions and his policies (and what has been done to cripple the middle class.) It truly leaves one wondering how he can pander as he does to the middle class and keep a straight face while doing it."

Now look at the Romney/Ryan plan. Same old stuff---just different names. Look to the people for change---not these crooks.

Fair enough Buckshot. Thank you for being polite. While I normally agree with your views I guess I am just disappointed in our "choices" and that really is my bottom line. I guess there is a good reason why "good people" do not become politicians.

Once again, I find myself totally agreeing with Buckshot. All we can say at this point is that Romney/Ryan or just about any Republican would do less damage to this country than Obama has done in less than four years. I, too, long for the day when Obama will just a distant memory of a really bad chapter in American politics. It's too bad, really, because Obama, being the first black U.S. President, could have showed the world that he was a good leader who helped get America back on it's feet after a failed Bush regime. Instead, he chose not only to continue on with Bush's out-of-control spending but increased it to insane levels. He proved himself to be just another run-of-the-mill tax and spend socialist liberal.

Like Buckshot said, there are lots of people out there hoping and praying that Romney/Ryan can steer this country back to fiscal sanity, and the principles that made us a great nation. If they can "swerve the ship", even a little bit, to the right of the iceberg, then there's still hope. I would hope that all of us like-minded people out there would not try to squash that hope.

By the way, Buckshot, where is "2016" playing?

CJW:

It is enough to make a sane person puke!

Change we can believe in---a trillion dollars at a time!

How do we measure the impact of a decision? In daily life, we judge it by before and after. Largely there are few factors that contribute to the result. The economy is one of complex, dynamic, moving parts that do not always predictably, rationally, or in ways that can be expressed in numerical form.

In the world of economics, we use models. The end result is the result of many factors. We attempt to attach a weight or measure of importance to each one of these factors. An example is such.

Y=.4a+ .3b+.2c+.1d+e

When a goes up by 1, Y goes up by .4 and so on. GDP or per capita GDP is the result that we debate in political circles. Higher per capita GDP leads to a better job market. Now before analysis no one knows the numbers in front of the a, b, c, d, and e. a could represent net exports, b could be consumer spending, c could be monetary policy (inflation) and so on. We assemble data and attempt the connect the dots and see how a, b, c, d, and e affect Y. When this is done with political decision such as stimulus, tax increase/decrease, subsidy, and regulation are factored in, the weight attached to them comes out to be about .05. Only 5% of the changes in GDP can be attributed to political decisions. Combine this with the fact that government expenditures only account for 13% of GDP and have never exceeded 22%. This tells me (and most others) that putting our economic eggs in the politician basket is not going to fix the economy. They are going to meddle some more and feebly attempt to fix it. All the while, the American people will stand by idly knowing that the true power to fix it lies in their hands.

buckshot......does sheep count,zombie count,etc they do to meI did not call you any names and OM didnt post any more FACTS than I DID.Like I said you just want to insult me because you think I am A LIBERAL..your words not mine "I hate liberals"AND IT COMES OUT LOUD AND CLEAR.I can post opinions,YOUR just acting out because what I said and her link justified it but I didnt post a link,Dont have too!!!!!this is not a research center.If I FEEL it WARRANTS A LINK I will POST ONE I HAVE CONTRARY TO WHAT YOU THINK DONE THAT BEFORE.But that was for and issue that I felt everyone could benifite from.Again we dont answer to you and if you continue to attack because I wont do it your way maybe some others here will decide that you are not the boss.certainly not mine.NOW on to better things.......

Another reference to the "bazookaman brigade" revolution?

CJW,

I came up with the 5% based on my own statistical analysis. It is called multiple regression. The business world uses it every second of every day and have since Windows 95 made the process quick and efficient. I could provide the data if you so desire. You will need a statistical software package in order to come to any meaningful conclusion.

http://www.marketplace.org/topics/econom...

I realize that you will discount this because it is not politically-biased. Dubner (author of Freakonomic) is a well respected journalist who is known for despising both parties and so has no dog in the fight.

Buckshot,

It is not algebra. It is called statistical analysis. The equation used above is an example of how the findings are represented. If we represented every thing in words only, the reports would be twenty pages long and 99% of the world would have no idea what they were reading. Every politician, businessman, and analyst in the modern realm is dependent on them. The unemployment rate is just one of them. The true driving force behind all economies is the consumer. Consumer demand explains more of the changes in the economy than anything else and always has.

The main platform for the modern politicians is jobs and economic growth. Statistical analysis and most economists will tell you that the president is little more than a cheerleader (and not the CEO) in the larger economic picture. Foreign policy, social issues, and such they are much more influential. So in short we are setting ourselves up for disappointment by pretending that the president can single-handedly fix the economy.

Your dog is uglier than my dog. And other pithy comments.

Its all ugly because people refuse to take their own council on the truth. And by that I mean, prayer, and utilizing all of the resources avaialable.

Politics: It's only a face that a mother could love. We have some really loving mothers out there.

NO ......MH RESIDENT....WHAT IS IN THAT POST IS WHAT SOMEONE GLEANED TO MAKE IT WHAT IT IS. Yes I went back and read it.BlaCk history cannot start in 1960,we dont need to be on our knees for anything.We are as much a part of the construction of this nation as anyone,the difference is whites drew the benefites of that construction from the START and WE DIDNT.Do YOU KNOW MH THAT AT ONE TIME A SLAVE WHO COULD READ WAS PUT TO DEATH AND THE PERSON WHO TAUGHT THEM TO READ WAS ALSO??? ASK yourself this,how could that impact today??? I will not waste my time going line for line on that post.IF you see that as truth then there is little I could say to disuade that.THE FACT THAT YOU WOULD POST IT AS UNEQUIVOCAL TRUTH SAYS IT ALL.YOU are the one who said IT came from a bigoted web site ,so then why did you post it????????WHAT'S NEXT?? MEIN KEMPF.

Try to remember that the tv is all about ratings and what you see there is not always the truth.IT'S there for it stun factor.Poor communities are all the same and dont for a moment believe that all black community's are poor. how's this......every time you pick up a news paper or on tv there asking to help the poor there is the face of color,but funny thing there are more poor whites than anybody but you never see there face on those kind of ads. Why not???tH THE DOWN SIDE IS IT TENDS TO LET YOU BELIEVE ONLY PEOPLE OF COLOR ARE POOR....WHICH WE KNOW IS NOT TRUE.I have traveled these united states I can take you places that poverty and illiteracy run rampant wether they are people of color or whites they all look the same,have the same problems,and survive the same ways.There is no monoply of poverty in the black community,that is a myth created by people who make a living off of others misfortunes.That includes the media ,the police,the churches ,the politicians,the banks and the list goes on.Cultural animose is big money MH AND THAT IS WHY IT HASNT STOPED.I didnt get into your post before because I didnt think it needed any explanation but I guess I was wrong.

JUST for the record these are my obsevations after years of teaching human relations and sociology.ANYONE who cares to do research on what IV said feel free I am sure you will have your own interpretation.

Glad to see you Bondy...You just said what my argument has been all along,and for me it takes on a different connotation,but it is the same.........later Iv got music to write.

"You and your group." Hmmmmmm.

CJW,

The true movers and shakers in the economy are business owners and consumers. If not then why have consumer expenditures never been less than 61% of GDP. You can find the data to back this up on www.bea.com or at the website for the non-partisan Congressional Budget Office. 95% of the changes in GDP come down to individual decisions and those made by business owners. So then why do we stand by the TV and pretend like the decisions of the President are all that matter?

Bazookaman: I'm an Independent but if it make you feel better you can also start gunning for us too.

Hey toughguy, do me a favor and don't lump me into your tirades to other posters. I've told you before and I'll tell you again, I'm not a liberal. Hopefully, your forgetful (senile) mind will absorb that.

Give me an example of when I've professed to be a liberal; give me an example of when I've statured myself as a liberal; give me an example of when I've ever done ANYTHING to lead anyone (save your self-hero persona) to believe that I'm a liberal.

Bottom line is, you can't stand it when someone calls you to task with your blathering idiocy. You have, rather craftily, professed that something is going to happen for the last 2 or 3 years. Little innuendos here and there, "imminent", "real soon,", come to mind. When questioned about it, you put your "cloak and dagger" jacket back on. ...speaking of jackets............

And I'm not looking for anything reference your ghostly comment about heads-up phone calls; I'm not trying to "rile" you into disclosing anything. Your mind is your mind, and, if in it, you believe your armeggedon will occur, so be it. Feel as important as you want to--

(Not many will get a "heads-up" phone call, and nobody on this net is going to rile or needle me into disclosing anything confidential, so you select lefties can taunt and make all the cute little remarks you want. You will get NOTHING.)

There is something even more fundamental to human existence than politics and government structure. The need to exist and therefore to trade. No one person has everything that they need physically, financially, or emotionally. This is the root of commerce and hence we have an economy. Economies happen whether the leadership is there or not. They happen whether the President is Democratic or Republican. Socialist or not. Communist or not. The governmental structure is just details. People will always strive to exist and make their life better. This behavior happens regardless of political decisions.

Think of when you went to the grocery store. Was the motivation behind your purchase personal? Was it because you were hungry? Were you desiring satisfaction? Or did you have only politics in mind? I doubt anyone would respond with the latter.

Most political endeavors into the economy affect the supply side of the equation. However, there would be no supply if not for demand. Cause and effect. The desire to have the good comes first then we can worry about producing it. Even then, if demand is high enough for something there is no stopping consumers. Illegal drugs are just one example. Regulations, taxes, and subsidies simply distort what is already there. The existence of demand for a product and its subsequent production are functions of the core human condition not politics.

Hence, Romney or Obama is going to get on their pulpit and claim to work miracles. The American public (suckers) will buy in. Meanwhile, never realizing that their individual decisions are what make things happen. Politicians are little more than cheerleaders. The real players meanwhile keep telling themselves that the cheerleaders are responsible for the wins and losses. Pretty ignorant but it is what it is.

BUCKSHOT......This is crystal clear ....You accuse me of voting for someone based on race,and then when I accuse you of doing the the same thing by not voting for him based on race you get offended....are you kidding me??????? I DID NOT PLAY ANY RACE CARD YOU DID REMEMBER. yOU ALWAYS TRY TO DO THE SAME THING AND THAT IS TO TURN SOMTHING AROUND AS IF YOU ARE INNOCENT,NICE TRY.

Remember this, fact without causality is not truth it is a one sided opinion,so when you post based on what you percieve is the truth based on facts if the cause of those facts are not there you are being deceptive.......

WHY DONT YOU....try and read the post and not read into it,and stop trying to discredit because you dont like what is being said and in my opinion who it's comming from.I say that because you have a special way you talk to me ex;"get this through your head" was that called for? you only do that garbage to me,and you do it all the time.Go talk down to your friends,BY the way you do that sends a not so subtle message and it's not a good one.You dont do it to anyone else how's that for as you say fact.......JUST so you know I dont really care that you dISPISE OBAMA...that's your business.but if you checked you would find a lot of his polocies mirrores PRES BUSH,THERE ARE MANY POLICIES COMMONALITY'S WITH GOV ROMENY,THE THING that set the tone for arguments is when he could say I AGREE WITH REPUBLICANS LET US GO THAT WAY AND THE MOMENT HE AGREE'S THEY TURN 180, THAT SAYS IT ALL.HAVE you considered that or doesnt it count?????

What's the matter? Me telling you what has been going on in the middle class black community doesnt fit expectations.Progress is and has been happening it suits certain groups and elements not to recognize that.........IT WOULD COST THEM MONEY........WHEN ANY GROUP CAN EMPLOYEE IT'S OWN PROGRESS STARTS HAPPENING BECAUSE THE MONEY REMAINS IN THE COMMUNITY AND THAT IS JUST ONE ISSUE.WHEN YOU FACE A BANKER THAT UNDERSTANDS THE COMMUNITY AND CAN GET A BUSINESS LOANS THAT CHANGES THE EQUATION......THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS YOU DONT KNOW ABOUT OR CARE ABOUT THAT CHANGES YOUR FACTS.INSTEAD OF TELLING ME YOUR REALITY WHY DONT YOU TRY HEARING MINE.

Zook,

What you forget conveniently is that I have 17 years of work experience in the manual labor world. I was raised poor and have been homeless. I have done the lowest jobs in the civilized world. Yeah, so I have seen the real world. Just because my life does not mirror yours does not mean jack diddly.

Yes, crooked politicians will learn to follow suit if they are voted out if they do not act fiscally responsible. It will take time. Let's hope that Americans do not counteract themselves with their usual short term thinking.

Finally, I had an argument with a coworker once. He held the belief that the mortgage crisis was 100% the fault of government. They enacted the policies and so what happens afterwards is their fault. The thousands of average Americans who made bad decision knowingly are to be let off the hook. The ones that knew that they could not afford what they were getting themselves into. Now do not convolute this with political ideology. This rash behavior happened in all 50 states and crossed the party line.

The government opened the gate but the people had choices. So according to those who believe that government controls everything, the citizens are just lemmings. They did not have the choice whether to be responsible or not.

Well, the question that I have is where were the guns being put to all these people's heads making them enter into the mortgages that they could not afford? I had the opportunity to buy and resisted. No one put a gun to my head. So there must be some choice on the behalf of the consumer. They acted irresponsibly and paid the price.

In closing, the behavior of the consumer was the main ingredient in the collapse. Just because something is offered, does not mean that one has to buy it. It all comes down to this, do you blame the sucker or the salesman?

I appreciate your posts twilcox1978. Thanks for hanging in here!

BUCKSHOT.....I have consistantly stated I voted for OBAMA because mc cainn picked PALIN.I played no race card, you did when you stated I should admit I voted for him because he was black....wrong.sO when I come back and say you dont like him because he's black and you attempt to turn that into I played the race card.What did you do??????you reading minds now and telling folks what they do and think,there you go stereotyping again.YOU dont really think I lend any credence to a fox news poll do you????IT couldnt get more partisan.

IF you got the message I am worried, I am not.The only truth you are concerned with is the truth that verifies your thoughts and ideas,that doesnt make it truth so keep on dreaming.Your preconceptions come out loud and clear.

RIGHT ON TWILL......ALL economist are on board with consumer demand,regardless of there political leanings.

I agree with twilcox on that.

It is odd that we are frustrated by a slow recovery to an economy that had such a large percentage of it based on a theory that expects all players to behave rationally. Sub prime mortgage? How could it be expected that the customers who took out sub prime offerings would be behaving rationally? The whole idea of subprime products strikes me as irrational, so I can't imagine much true benefit to the economy. Kind of a fruit of the poisonous tree thing. For lack of a better metaphor.

"One huge reason they went bankrupt was that the citizens weren't productive enough", eh??

Funny how that happens when you realize that you're only busting your butt so the government can take THEIR chunk.....then "spread the rest of the wealth" to the slackers.

Then you would agree that the citizens of that nation were responsible for the change in the economy and not government? Choices made by the citizens made them bankrupt. So do the citizens do matter to an economy? Or not?

I am going to leave this be for now. I am talking about the macroeconomy not individual situations. BS61, I deal with companies as well but in an indirect fashion and have data to back up my assertions. This forum is not the best arena for displaying that. Oh well, I am going to continue to be incredibly cynical every time I hear a slick speech that tells us all that they will create jobs. You can go ahead and believe it. That's fine. You will be disappointed every time and always have more to complain about.

And any time you have to explain "what the point was/is" (even if only in your mind)---the point is lost. Buried in double talk, lip service and good old bull manure. It is like belly button lint and toe jam---annoying.

BS61,

"Yes, politicians CAN create jobs.....by GETTING OUT OF THE WAY OF THE PRIVATE SECTOR AND NOT HAMPERING IT!"

thanks for restating what I have said for the last four years on this blog.

"Everyone knows there's MANY factors in economic ups and downs here in America. "

If you really believe that then why do and you and everyone else always attribute economic performance solely to politics. If asked how to fix the economy, most Americans (including those on here), would start their answer with government. If asked about what affects it, those same people, would start their answer with government so obviously Americans are being myopic or short sighted as well.

Now I will ask it again. Do you believe that any politician (regardless of party) can live up to their promises of creating X amount of jobs? When you hear the speeches, do you buy into it?

I was disappointed in the quality of the Newsmax link.

Say again?

No offense there, Twilcox, but I don't think many of the bloggers on here really appreciate you delving into your college Economics class lessons on here. I'm guessing most of us believe in the cause and effect of politicians or government policies on the economy. It DOES matter who is in the White House and whose running the country. Look what Obama has done to this country in less than four years! That ought to tell you something.

The $6400 figure that Obama uses on his attack ads was derived by the process of regression. That is why it is worded as "being as much as 6400" and not exactly $6400.

It does not take a bunch of rhetoric to tear down Obama's two main failures; ARRA and the Keystone pipeline. I will give the cliff notes version. The ARRA was a failure because in more cases than not it had zero impact. Not negative or positive. Impartial analysis has shown that the funds made no measurable difference to most communities.

The Pipeline would not have created all that many jobs. They would have been temporary and only resulted in retail revenues. However, the pipeline itself would in time have resulted in stabilizing gas prices. It takes years for the effects to show up at the pump. However, stable prices are better than the nearly perpetual increase.

I am not saying that we should not drill but we should keep our expectations down as well. Expecting a 50% (or some other large number) decrease in gas prices in weeks or months is ludicrous. Americans are well known to themselves and others around the world for their love of instant rewards. Most Americans do not factor in the reality that it is a global market place and that refineries are horribly expensive to build and operate.

Alright, lets move on the topic of Romney and Ryan.

I do not care for their stances on purely social issues such as abortion and gay marriage. Their stance on how to "fix" Medicare is sound but it would seem to me that they need to back it up with more. The idea is sound but the rationale given to the media and on TV is weak. Are Americans really that simple minded that they always need the cliff notes version of everything? They would do best to flesh it out. I may be wrong but I contend that if they did they would convert some current skeptics.

Speaking of fleshing things out, I'm skeptical of this. It sounds good, but is it deliverable?

http://money.cnn.com/2012/08/02/news/eco...

Dave,

I looked at that link and have to say that I am a bit skeptical as well. There are a lot of ifs involved.

On another note, it is sad that candidates feel that they have to promise miracles. Why not just state the cold, hard truth? The truth of the matter is that his ideas may or may not work.

I would hope everyone read the link......but most would be more apt to, without the sarcasm about cheerleading,totaly uncalled for and meant to antagonize and provoke.

Good source but not the only one.Just adds to the argument depends on what you want to hear.The pro and cons vary and boil down to whats best for most not necessarily all.Thanks for the read.

GEE BUCKSHOT....I even thanked you for the read and you just cant be pleasant, what's it going to take??? ALL people who dont think like you to die???......NOT YET

Lamont---please get your own blog. Take the conspiracy to your own forum. All of the "banter" deflects from the real debate. So Buckshot is a "racist" in youlr eyes and you do not like him---we got the message over and over and over again. Please, give it a rest or take it to your own blog. Please! Thank you.

Romney/Ryan would support a drastic cut, if not elimination, in the federal student aid program. This issue is a complex one. A bit of a chicken or the egg dilemma. Some contend that the rising costs are too much for the average student. That might be true. However, federal student aid and how easy it is to receive it has been the largest factor in the rising cost of attending college. As some say, You can't unring the bell. That is probably true in this case. So what should we do?

First, if we simply do away with it the number of college students will drop dramatically. I am not sure if that is a bad thing or not. However, towns like La Grande, OR, Dillon, MT, and Lewiston, ID which derive a huge part of their economy from university attendance will be affected greatly. They will complain. They will petition the legislature. They will come up some with very well thought out arguments. They are fighting for their very survival and so this is expected. The trick is to take the emotion out of it and deduce whether this is best for all parties involved or not.

Spending cuts would not be so difficult if both sides were not so invested in re-election opportunities and ways to fill their pockets.

If we started with waste and moved our way around to redundant agencies, there would probably be a trillion or so there. And no one would get their feelings hurt except the wasteful people and who needs them anyway?

What can we afford to keep? Our military to keep our nation safe. No more $1,000 hammers or toilets though. We should reverse their pay to what senators and representatives make and allow those elected officials to take on their pitiful wages.

One agency to cover the poor. And eliminate any benefits that have previously been given to illegals.

Audit the IRS. They jump at dimes while countless billions slip their "eagle eyes." by obvious fraud.

And again, withould payment to any employee, elected official or agency that fails to do their job.

How come we can see that and no one else can?

"Spending cuts would not be so difficult if both sides were not so invested in re-election opportunities and ways to fill their pockets."

That pretty much sums up the problem.

They can't see through their rose colored glasses.

MsM---key words "SO FAR." 375 is just the start.

Breitbart was a right wing conservative who is dead. Who's running his web site now?

Key Words "SO FAR"......... 2012 is almost over

If Romney gets in then I am sure you won't have to worry about more IRS Agents in 2013.

Don't worry your pretty little head, it's all in God's hands.

Buckshot Good thing its raining today, you were getting to the point you need to get out of the sun and off that Golf Coarse for awhile... I worry about you!

Is it true if Romney gets in he is only going to lower taxes for the rich?

I've let your plagiarism slide so leave me alone.

ALRIGHT DAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!

BUCKSHOT......YOUR ATTITUDE OF MY WAY OR THE HIWAY GETS OLD AND SOMEONE ELSE SAID IT,AND YOU DONT LIKE IT.I AM NOT STIRRING THE WATERS.To bad you dont call out your cheering group they come when called.pom pom's ,megaphone?? dONT NEED ANY OF THAT TO RECOGNIZE WHAT WE SEE.CHILDREN??? bASED on your name calling and put downs I would say the child is on you......and dont forget your projections of everything you are.Some of us do see you for what your are and it's not pretty contrary to what you believe..........you have a great day and try and keep your insults confined to your group of ideologe faithfull,they might appreciate it we dont.

Re-read some of your past posts and then have the audacity to come on here and insinuate childlike activities. You are such a tool, child.

I agree Twilcox. I've appreciated your posts and thanks for providing unregurgitated food for thought.

Zook,

One has to analyze or use their brain for something other than something to fill their skill in order to know "communism" is happening. Get as emotional as you want but in the end you have to think it through.

I spent some time in a country with socialized medicine as well, and spent a bit of time in hospitals there because a family member suffered from chronic debilitating illness. He always received great care from caring nurses and doctors, who seemed quite happy with their health care system.

I retired after serving our country too. And if one of the purposes of my service was to diminish the worldwide influences our country's enemies have so that our country might take a percentage of the money that is spent to keep us safe and use it to keep us all healthier, my service time has been well spent.

*someone is young*

Fit that into the third line of the final paragraph.

My editor took a vacation.

Zook,

You and BS61 are truly amazing. You both rail against socialism. I just got done tearing down socialized medicine and this is all you have to say. Oh well.

BS61,

Put your reading glasses on and scroll up two posts above yours. Read the first line and first word. Who is that referring to? Hmmm....

Yes, I talk about a variety of topics. You do as well. So what is the issue?

Are you certain of that? Got a quote from the President?

Didn't ignore Netanyahu.

http://www.sfgate.com/business/bloomberg...

YOU KNOW,,,,EVEN REPUBLICANS HAVE SAID THERE WAS NO APOLOGY.....Is there something wrong with seeing what is real......what was said was issued 6 hrs before anything happened about what was happening.HATE distorts and the distortions become worst everyday.MR Hannity is out of his mind.I guess we should start shooting people and the right wing will be happy.I hope they are willing to send there sons and daughters.HAVNT HEARD ONE SAY THERE kids ARE WEARING UNIFORMS TO INCLUDE HANNITY AND ROMNEY.LET me know when that happens......Nobody attacked BUSH in time of crisis. UNREAL....

YES .......HE LIED AND 5 THOUSAND PLUS DIED....YES HE GOT ATTACKED DAYS AFTER ,NOT THE DAY IT TRANSPIRED.I HAVE NOT FORGOTTEN THE LIE.yOU can call the phrase stupid from now till the cows come home.....it hit the nail right on the head.36, thousand maimed and wounded .....for what??? And guess what it wasnt your job creaters kids that that happened to.Funny how they find a way not to serve........I GUESS THEY HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO........RIGHT !!!!!!!!!!

Now I dont know where you get off with my party but if it makes you feel good to say that go for it.Ill continue to back who I think is best for the nation as a whole.SO before you throw up the partisan garbage go look in the mirror.

WE have not lost more troops in afganistan than iraq.You would like that to be the case because that war is considered to be OBAMA'S WAR,which it's not,but whatever,we shouldnt have been there either.Both those wars are the product of a lie and you think I favor one over the other you have the problem.I want them all to end and our kids home NOW.There is no sane reason for us to be there PERIOD.those country's will have theocratic governments for years it suits there needs.IT may not be productive in the sense we know it but it maintains a certain sense of order and that is not going to change for some time,having our kids dieing in order to bring about a change that is not wanted makes no sense.

I never said who I was voting for,just as I HAVE NOT TAKEN OWNERSHIP FOR PARTY AFFILIATION.DONT TRY TO TELL PEOPLE WHAT THEY ARE GOING TO DO BASED ON YOUR FRAME OF REFERENCE.OH YEAH YOUR ONE OF THEM YOU HAVE NO ROOM TO CALL ANYONE PARTISAN, NONE.

All THE NAME CALLING,SARCASM,LEAVES NO DOUGHT WHAT YOU ARE,PLUS YOUR DECLARATION.I'm ok with it just dont try to project that garbage on to me.

It puzzles me how people who's only current source of information about a President's actions is limited to what is gleaned from the media can make any confident determination as to whether he is or was an effective leader. If you think you get "all you need to know" visit a presidential library or comb through some declassified documents. Then you may discover that you are not very effective evaluator.

No , I'm not saying I have anything like you described CJW. I'm just letting you know that you don't either.

And if you want to pass the "Don't Poke the Bear" warning on to the cretin who thought he'd do us all a favor and post a video that would incite a riot, by all means, do it!

And don't give me the "freedom of speech " lecture. Even here in the United States, our freedom of speech does not extend to speech that incites violence.

CHA CHING

Thanks for playing homey.

CJW, It looks like you gave me about 3 minutes to reply.

I'm out here supporting and defending, so it took me a while to get back.

So on the basis of this story alone, you're endorsing a demonstration of world leadership where the United States of America, while seeking to maintain credibility with all nations and improve the nations stature with others, would adopt a national defense policy allowing our Generals in the U.S. Armed Forces to summarily execute prisoners, and then desecrate their bodies upon burial.

Is that right?

I'm not going to go fishing to confirm of the veracity of the "stewed and strained for those with limited comprehension" links you like to consider facts.

And you keep repeating the same stuff and you just keep getting nastier about it.

Obama 2012

That's from SCOTUS?

Naw! Just a Demolition Man

The Police- Ghost In The. Machine - 1981

I'm getting an answer re: free speech and incitement to violence. Stay tuned for Brandenburg v. Ohio.

Weather will follow!

CJW, Here are some sources to check out re: your request from on this thread at 0804 today.

You and your protege will discount them, but. I decided to provide them so the other participants can enjoy them.

All of these links deal with Brandenburg v. Ohio

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/hi...

http://billofrightsinstitute.org/resourc...

http://www.oyez.org/cases/1960-1969/1968...

http://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/...

http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/hi...

Further, I'll not engage in the what if's regarding South Park and Jesus. I've never watched a full episode of South Park.

Further still, the Supreme Court is not a part of this, or any other administration.

Now, this is the last hoop I'll jump through for anybody on this thing. I'll post what I post. It's up to you to follow up and determine if it's credible or not.

I'm off for a weekend trip. Feel free to snipe.

Dave,

Enjoy your trip.

The main premise behind the Romney/Ryan is less government, less taxes, and spending cuts.

Less government is never a bad thing. Most Liberals feel that humanity is inherently greedy and only motivated by self-interest. Therefore, we need regulations/bureaucracy to police this behavior. There are examples in history that back them up but they are pretty rare in the grand scheme. The primary reason that we need less government is simple. The more layers one adds to the government, the more inefficient it becomes. For every layer we install, the cost of performing the task increases. Is the end result really that much better than if we simplified it? Not really.

Thanks twilcox

I understand. I agree that there are inefficiencies that can be resolved and they will be through diligence and a commitment to continued improvement.

My experience with environmental issues drives my belief that individuals will take the path of least resistance when it comes to, say, proper disposal of hazardous wastes. It's easier to dump it on the ground and walk away. I'm not putting it all on the backs of those who preceded us; the extent of the hazards of the materials released around my hometown were not fully understood until decades after their release. Which is a good reason to obtain good environmental studies based on accurate science before allowing projects with the potential for significant environmental impact.

I believe the EPA and state environmental agencies should work in collaboration with industry, similar to OSHA's Voluntary Protection Program.

I explained my reasoning for my support of the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.

CJW. add "Renaissance Man" to the list and delete all others.

http://www.foreignassistance.gov/Country...

Sorry man. www.foreignassistance.gov

Might have to type it in.

We left Afghanistan alone for several years before 2001, and nothing improved during our absence and it has been enormously difficult to affect change since we've been back.

Who knows which country would gain the most influence in the

region if we up and left? Northeastern Africa that is.

If we withdraw our presence from Egypt, does Iran. China or Russia gain the most in regard to the Suez Canal? Would that place added burdens on the Israelis?

Make that Morsi.

Buckshot61, CJW- "K2" - Did you guys get that Brandenburg v. Ohio case figured out? Ref: my post made yesterday at 1112. You just gonna let that one go because you stepped in it when you brought that up? Remember you put the challenge out there ref: the ref in my post made yesterday at 1112.

NATIONAL SECURITY......the catch all.....when our attitudes going in is such that we dont respect there right to exist how can we influence, you have already told them you dont want to.IT is simple for me,cut them off and let them go it alone.....who knows they might be a lot better off without our input.I said it I'll say it again we need to stop the manifest destiney garbage.Supreme rulers are what they understand,IT'S PART OF THERE CULTURE LET IT GO.wHEN TIME TO CHANGE COMES THEY WILL CHANGE IT.

I did not get and apology out of the presidents original response,i got something I am getting a little tired of and it is causing him problems, we are not students quite talking to us like we are..........that's my opinion.

I have to disagree with you Buckshot61. Just as I said yesterday. When the European Union gave aid to the United States, it wasn't given solely to the Republican party because we had a Republican president at that time.

Your initial contention made back on Wed, Sep 12th at 10:18 pm was that President Obama gave money to the Muslim Brotherhood. It is against U.S. law for our government to donate money to a foreign political party like the Muslim Brotherhood. Your argument appears to be an attempt to perpetuate the question as to whether President Obama is actually a Muslim.

Today you've changed your contention and say that since the Muslim Brotherhood holds office, the money must go to them. I know the aid flows to the government of Egypt, which is made up of representatives of several political parties.

More on inciteful speech being excluded from free speech to follow.

I believe you are taking the statements you quoted from the Embassy in Cairo out of their proper context in the hope that you may convince others to believe that they apply to the violence that closely followed the release of the Cairo statement, and by extension, you're relying on the emotions that arise from the deaths of the embassy staffers to support that falsehood.

Further, since our freedom of speech excludes the

right to speech that incites violence, it would be illogical for the President to apologize for the producer of the video.

the moral to the story in Egypt and the Middle East is that we should be nonexistent. It's not that complicated. No troops, no embassies, no aid, no intervention, nada. The holy wars will go on regardless of our involvement so let them iron out and kill each other.

CJW, BS61- More smack. You guys have taken community property to a whole new level. You evenly share in your stupidity.

Sounds like something a Nazi would say before he comes to power. Yup BS, CJW and OM sure don't like others to use their Freedom of Speech! They are the Hitlers of the blogs!!

They know everything! Next time I need an answer I'll ask one of them. Save time, your dime, ask the 3 amigos

Hey everyone watch whats happens after this post!

hmmmmmmm can you guess!

OM Your so predictable! Now its time for the other 2 amigo's to put in their babble

Hey Blog NAZI Captain Morgan isn't my choice of drink, I prefer Bacardi Light with a twist of Lemon. Now go back to your addiction which screams OCD ...... Shame!

CJW writing your ignorant comments on here shows you have a larger void in your life, seeings how your here more then me.... You have to much time on your hands!

Dave,

from reading the article that speak of the 79.5 million hours, it appears that it is saying that collectively small business owners and interested Americans will spend 79.5 million hours reading, studying, and examining the new law(s).

There are roughly 6 million firms with 500 employee or less. So if we divide that up, that comes out to about 13 hours per firm. What someone deduces out of that is up to them.

It is essentially a tax. However, putting an exact dollar amount on what each firm loses is near impossible. However, it does not matter. It is still 13 hours that they could be doing something else.

Thanks Buckshot! I appreciate it. rotflmbo

Have a good day.