yoB, you are right do the Math, I don't think they can build for $100 per square foot let along 67 to 75 like they been talking about. With 1.1 million in the bank that doesn't even come close to building a 30,000 build which like you say it could take 3 million. If all you are going to have to start with is pools which are the most costly membership will never happen like it is being put out, pools DO NOT MAKE A REC CENTER by themselves either. To get enough money the way things are going would take another 20 years to even think about building, thats not going to happen that way, I am all for the padlock on the door and put a stop to the nonsense but guess we have to wait until Nov when it shows on the ballo how it will go.

So lets say that in the 5 years it takes to save the money Mr. Obama fixes this economy. How much will it cost then? $120, $130 per square foot? Are you willing to wait another 5 years? When is enough, enough?

Enough is enough now, IMO. We tried to talk to the WECRD Board---FOR MONTHS. We told them we would start the petition if we did not see change...well, see where we are at? It was like beating your head against a wall speaking with them.

As far as how long this has taken, MBG ran her "reelection" on the fact that this facility would be started this year (and there was less money in the bank then). We have said for the last year they DID NOT have the money. MBG fought us on that point. So, now Ms. Smith tells us there is not enough money because she has done the math! Funny, we have said that for the last year and have been told we are full of it. So, what is the story now Ms. Smith. We did the math and asked you to do the same. Now the light has come on? What about the money to run the place and pay people? Where will that come from? There is no magic pot of gold here. I am glad you did the math but those are the very same figures I have posted time and time again. What about change orders, cost overruns, etc. What about that part of the "budget?" Oh wait, they did not include many "what ifs" in their plan. That is why people are angry. It has been 10 years. We have done the math and MBG and her team still say it can be done with what they have. People are tired. Maybe MBG will quit. It would be the best thing for the project and the future of this center, IMO.

You want all or nothing just like the WECRD. Pools were to be built in Phase II, not Phase I due to cost and lack of cost recovery associated with pools. This facility should be off the ground and in operation BEFORE the most expensive part is added so that at least it is bringing in some money. That will help to determine some degree of interest. Why start with a black hole right from the start? There is NO cost recovery with pools...THEY DO NOT MAKE MONEY!!!

Enough is enough and the signatures will make that point.

Funny...Jana was involved in the new meeting rule regarding public comment. Pardon me if I fail to "see the light" in this regard. As for Marsha...we shall see. The donation issue was not a good start.

I don't believe 600 annual passes at $400 is realistic. Going back to the Jerome Rec Center as an example...about the same polulation with about the same average income, they sell just over 200 similarly priced passes a year. I wouldn't expect more than 250 here in WEC. At every turn the numbers just don't add up.

Funny...the GP Report indicated 1,000 annual passes would be sold. Where is that "missing" income going to be made up for in the budget? That is a lot of money! So...the WECRD must have felt the GP numbers were a bit high. Where was the budget adjustment made for this?

Use numbers are still too high based on what is going on in other areas with these centers. So, yoB...where is that money that does not come in going to be made up at? Cha ching! Tax payers. My oh my...it is another golf course without all of the pretty grass and the neat carts to drive!

I wish something would be done either build or disolve so people can shut up. No minds are going to be changed the naysayers are always going to be against this current plan because of the pools the people for it can look past the pools and see the potential of what could be built. I hope that this community can have a center but I don't see it happening because to many people in this town who will find fault in everything because it either takes to long, they don't think is can be supported, has more in it than they think it should, and yes I know to all of you they are good arguments, to me I wish you would put more energy into making it better rather than tear it down. Maybe you should have started a petition to get rid of the pools only and not the whole facility.

Beth, I guess November will tell the tale for all. I am willing to bet that you are 100% wrong and that this will be disolved. You have the WECRD Board to thank for that and nobody else. What you always fail to mention is that we did meet with them and we did talk to them...for months! They refused to listen. What can a group of people do about that? Now, we have a new rule regarding public comments at meetings. It does not sound to me like they want to listen to ANYBODY unless you agree with them. So be it. I can live with the money going to the county. At least it will go back into the community and be used for recreation which is more than I can say about the money now.

Yob,

you said the "new" directors seem less set in thier ways. I have to ask why do you say this when one was handpicked by Ms. Marsh and the she was involved in the selection of the other? Seems to me that she would select people who shared the same views as her.

As for what the community needs, seems very simple to me. Ask the Mt Home News to do a poll on what the community needs (a) rec center with pools or (b) rec center with NO pools. While this poll would not be offical at least the community could speak their minds to the board on a forum that they might actually listen to. Maybe YoB can get them to see what the community needs.

Old guy,

I say Jana and Marsha seem less set in their ways because they haven't been as involved as Mollie has from the very begining. Mollie is fighting for what she truely believe the community wants. Marsha and Jana, i believe are still trying to figure out how things work.

OM,

I think the WECRD listened to you they just dont agree with you, that is the difference. They are going by the information that they have. Maybe if you had done the survey on who wanted pools and who didn't and presented those numbers it would have been different. You didn't do that you told them what you thought about the pools they don't agree so you are going to try to disolve them. I hope you are wrong when it comes up for vote in December, this town needs this community center and I will say it again. If you really wanted a center like you keep saying you would have found a way to work on it. With doing a survey, volunteering to help raise money, or even put in for the position. You didn't do that you just ran your mouth at meeting telling them how wrong they are and when they didn't listen you in my opionion over reacted and just started to get them disolved. One question, you are all about facts and figures, how many people don't want the pool, how many people can't afford the fee. My family wants the pool and can afford the fee. Don't say people don't and can't afford I want the actual numbers

Good ST...you want the numbers. Get to work. All you do is run your mouth. And FYI..I did help with a fund raising project for the WECRD last year when we were attempting to "work" with them. I have met with them over and over. My numbers will come in the form of that petition with 500 more signatures than were needed. That is all I will come up with regard to this project. I have donated enough of my own time and money to this. Thank you. Please let us know what ou find out. Oh...and pretty much 100% of the people who signed the petition are AGAINST the pools but would support a recreation center without the pools. Does that work for you ST? The vote is in November...not December as you stated.

Oh, and one more thing ST and BB. You speak as if I am the only person in our "group." That is not the case...I am not just one person claiming to represent others. We have gone into the WECRD office as a group and we have attended WECRD Board meetings, and spoke, on behalf of that group and as a group. So, it is not just me unhappy with this plan---it is many.

Has the WECRD Board ever welcomed the public to ANY of the meetings in th last 6 months? No. We are greeted with a sour look from Mollie every time. As far as the WECRD Board being treated poorly, I disagree. Unless you think of the public asking for answers, after 10 years, being treated poorly. One more thing. Most of the people who attend the WECRD Board Meetings (with standing room only at some) are not happy and represent a portion of the public that does not agree with this current plan. Do they listen to those people?

Again, they listen they just don't agree with you. If you speak to them like you blog on here I would give you a sour look also. Has your group gone up to the board after a meeting and said we would like to work with you to get this built or have you just told them that you don't want the pools. You keep saying Mollie is going to build this with the pools and isn't listening to anyone. You do the same thing, you keep saying this can't be built with the pools, and you don't listen to anyone who says we want the pools, you tell us we don't know anything and we just want to spend everyones money. Guess what I for one know my family would you the pools and I can only speak for myself but spending $400.00 on a year pass for my family is a bargin, it works out to less than $8.00 a week, for the family $2.00 a week per person.

Ok I have to jump in here. It seems ST and BB are ATACKING OM because her husband served to protect their family. I can tell you that I am retired and the FREE medical care I was promised for life, I PAY for now. How dare either of you attack her for this. You have stepped way over the line here. This is a sore spot with me and if you want to meet and discuss this in person pick the place and I can enlighten you as to the cost of care and the quality of care. I suggest you stop this attack and might even consider an apology not only to OM but all of us that have served YOUR country.

OG, thank you for your service. Those of us who have the insurance understand the price that is paid and how hard it can be to get care.

It does not change the fact that the WECRD is still a mess and in 10 years we are right back at the starting line with a lot of money spent for NOTHING. BB would like the attention off of that. Nice try.

Got an email from Jana today by the way regarding the YMCA and the working groups. They are working on it. They figure they may have their groups by the end of the month. They have had some issues with schedules and that has been part of the delay. As I get more info, I will let you all know. Have a nice night.

OM,

Thank you for your support. I can tell you in my 20+ years of active military and 5 yrs federal civil service the support of the citizens means the most. I figured others (BB $ ST) are trying to steer us away from the main issue, why the WECRD has done nothing but spend spend spend over the last 10 years with what to show for it? Oh we have a pretty sign, the board has cell phones (why?) and reports that are useless.

Let us know as you get more info. I will be out of town on/off over the next few weeks dealing wit a sick parent and some family obligations but will check in as time permits.

yoB,

Hope the debate went well tonight. While we may not agree on some issues, I respect you for standing up for your beliefs.

Old guy,

No one was attacking OM because of her husband's service, or for that matter, anyone who served. OM stated previously, "I pay for my own recreation/medical/health needs." ST rebutted with the fact that OM's husband works for the government and, as such, she does receive health insurance through her husband's service (paid for by all taxpayers; you, me, her ((see, she even pays for it herself)), BB, ST, etc...). Although she might pay out of her own pocket for needs that TriCare doesn't cover, she does benefit from TriCare. And just to let you know, I received the same "promise" you did for medical care, and I too, pay for it now. But, the price we -retired military- pay, is a far cry from what non-retired military people pay for health insurance.

OM,

"And as for your Hitler remark, your memory must be selective because my being Jewish has been out there more than once. It has not been a secret and has been posted about. Nice try and I do believe from your other posts that you fully understood what you stated since you are always right. So, nice try. You are nothing more than a racist which is great representation for the WECRD and their cause.

So, sorry because you said something really stupid or sorry because I forwarded your comment on and someone was not very happy with you? Big difference. Save the I am sorry. Have a nice day because you sure made mine!"

-- Posted by OpinionMissy on Thu, Mar 19, 2009, at 1:15 PM

Remember that? If so, why do you keep bringing it up? I don't recall anyone bringing it up in that context since March 19.

My goodness, see what happens when you try to debate a crazy woman? I know better but couldn't help myself.

Redroth and BB, you 2 deserve each other. Enjoy.

Let's not forget about the basic allowance for housing (BAH) that we the taxpayers kick in. If you qualify to live off post and choose to do so you will receive a (BAH). This pay is to help cover some of the cost associated with off post housing. One may use their BAH to either rent or purchase a home. The BAH rates for Mountain Home AFB, ID effective Jan 1, 2009 are as follows:

Rank BAH w/o Dependent BAH w/ Dependent

E-1 $674 $898

E-2 $674 $898

E-2 $674 $898

E-4 $674 $898

E-5 $758 $991

E-6 $846 $1112

E-7 $904 $1199

E-8 $1018 $1278

E-9 $1061 $1355

W-1 $862 $1129

W-2 $1018 $1232

W-3 $1065 $1327

W-4 $1146 $1366

W-5 $1217 $1411

O-1E $991 $1215

O-2E $1051 $1312

O-3E $1128 $1373

O-1 $804 $1007

O-2 $959 $1125

O-3 $1079 $1323

O-4 $1207 $1430

O-5 $1254 $1503

O-6 $1327 $1515

O-7 $1353 $1533

http://mountainhomehousing.com/bah.php

No wonder so many people homestead here. If the taxpayers would give me an extra $1000.00 + per month I might have a hot tub, horses, motorcycles, etc. as well. One thing for sure though, I wouldn't be "up to my eyeballs in debt." This missy person needs a new sustainable plan. .

Pale Ale,

Where did that come from? Retired members don't get any BAH or any of the other non-taxable benifits that active duty members get. The only 'benefit' they get is a reduced cost health insurance that only covers a portion of the costs associated with medical care, unless it is done on base. No optical or dental, that is out of pocket. Anyone who puts up with the military for 20+ years deserves the little bit they get. You, BB and ST really need to get a clue before you point fingers. I think jealousy is rear its ugly head.

I retired in 2002 and as far as I know, up until that point the military members were not even close to being overpaid. I doubt much has changed in that regard over the last few years.

jtrotter

Just what am I jealous of? My whole point of my blog once again was to just point out that OM recieves benefit from tax payers money. My husband is military, we have tri care, we get BAH, he will retire in a few years. So I ask what am I jealous of?

Vic, I retired in 1986 and alot has changed since then dealing with pay, sure those today get more from their base pay due to their raises over the years than I do that held the same rank upon retirement.

small town, you just don't get it all military people and civilians in government are paid by tax dollars all the way up the chain to even the President, I may as well add I am now on social security also which the government put that money in the general fund and spend it on everything but retirement and the account is going broke on account of it and anyone that has worked has paid into SS.

Eagle eye,

That is exactly my point, if you read what I said

you will see that I say that OM benefits from taxpayers money. So do I and everyone else, I was reponding to her saying that the doesn't need taxpayers money. That is not a true statement on her behalf. Please read the whole thing that I said don't concentrate on the military part.

The point boys & girls is that this pMissy rails about the use of tax payers money when much of her livilihood and some of her toys have been substadized by we the taxpayers.

Pale Ale:

You missed my point (are you related to BB...2nd cousins maybe?). My point was that my medical needs, such as the hot tub, are not for the taxpayers to pay. It is my illness. I DO NOT expect the people of this community to pay for my medical needs. That was my point.

As far as my ability to manage my money---I have 2 jobs. I pay my own bills. I have NEVER received any "help" from the government in the form of SSI, WIC, food stamps, etc. I work hard and play hard. When I ask YOU to pay my bills...then you can tell me that my "plan" sucks and should be reworked. Again, when you pay my bills, which YOU DO NOT...then you have a say.

Fecal matter in the brain is not brain matter there Pale Ale. And as far as the government or you "paying for my toys"...I work for a living and that is how I pay for things. You are one sorry, ignorant, piece of work. Retired military do NOT get housing. So, where is that "extra $1,000 per month" from?

So since I pay taxes and some of that money goes to active duty and retirees, am I (just like every military family) subsidizing the government through taxes which in turn is subsidizing my income through my retirement pay? Point being, it never should have been made a point at all. Simply being an employee of any federal, state, or local government agency means you are receiving your pay from taxes, which we all pay. But funding your recreation through taxes is completely different. To not be able to see the difference seems ridiculous to me. To try to make a correlation between the two is even more absurd.

Pale Ale/POS...if you think my husband's government pay even comes close to "substadized" (your word) /supporting my "toys" you are really out of touch! I work outside the home and pay my own way and object to your reference that the government in any way pays my way. I pay taxes and have NEVER used any form of assistance EVER. However, the government feels free to take from me for bailouts and recreation centers. So, pardon me, if I fail to see just how much the government has paid MY way. Pull that head out from between those cheeks you are about to flat line!

ST, I cannot even believe that you have said what you said. You leave me without words on this most recent "debate" or bunch of BS. If you are indeed the wife of a military person, you know that the military is NOT a free ride/subsidy. My husband works some long hours and spends a great deal of time gone. They get injected with who knows what each year. I do not see my husband's pay as a "government handout" or free. I think he is underpaid and our/his health insurance stinks.

Put more energy into looking into the WECRD and their "plan" and see how things really work.

Yes, it is great to pay taxes so that I can pay my husband's yearly wages. While this nation is in a financial crisis we want pools and MORE taxes while other parts of the US are closing their centers because of a lack of funding (or, nobody can afford to PAY to use them). Makes perfect sense to me. Now this is a debate! So, once the center is built, will they stop the taxes? They say they have a "sustainable plan" which would mean once this facility is up and built they should be able to pay for it all based on what is raised through use as opposed to our money. Right? They have been taxing for construction for the last 9-10 years...not for payroll and repairs. Come on yoB...will the taxes stop once built?

Yes ST, how about if we do stay on topic. It was you that stated by my husband being military and paid by the taxpayers that I live off the government. This is your topic. Now that the heat is on...you want a change.

So, when this facility is built (because that is what the taxes are for) will the taxing stop? It should if the "plan" is sustainable. If it is not then we will have to continue to "support" this facility through taxes. That makes it not really sustainable.

But heck, what do I know? I am just on the military gravy train waiting for my next handout. What a "cushy" life we must lead.

Buy your definition of sustainable anything that taxes go to help pay for is non sustainable. Than we should just get rid of it all that way we will have no services yet you won't be paying taxes for it. The bus system that help the elderly would be dropped because they receive tax money, park and rec programs,which benefit kids should be dropped, all these programs are sustainable because of the tax money.

Same reason they tax for the golf course, not everyone uses it yet it is still available for the whole communtiy. I have never golfed a day in my life yet my taxes go for it. Such like I don't use a lot of the things my tax dollars go to but the are available if I need them.

MM, because I can! It was said to me/about me and believe me...the racist remark must live on. If you are dumb enough to say something like that...you deserve to be reminded, IMO. She represents the WECRD since she donates time once a week. You are what you surround yourself with.

From OM herself...

"yoB, if you were not so worried that the "naysayers" would get this voted down, you would stay away from the personal attacks."

"You are one sorry, ignorant, piece of work."

"All you do is run your mouth."

"You are a piece of work and one heck of a "great" representation of this group and what they stand for. Keep talking as you are wonderful PR for my position."

"So ST and Beth take that for what it is worth and both of you can stick it."

If you are dumb enough to say something like that...you deserve to be reminded,

"You are a bitter, ignorant, racist and I really have no use for people like you. I wonder why the WECRD keeps you after that "Hitler" post of yours ... Do you treat other ethnic groups the same way? Just wondering. You are like gum on the bottom of my shoe..."

"you 2 deserve each other. Enjoy."

"take that for what it is worth and both of you can stick it."

"Pull that head out from between those cheeks you are about to flat line!"

"MM, because I can! It was said to me/about me and believe me...the racist remark must live on. If you are dumb enough to say something like that...you deserve to be reminded, IMO. She represents the WECRD since she donates time once a week. You are what you surround yourself with."

-- Posted by OpinionMissy on Fri, May 8, 2009, at 11:00 PM

OM,

Why, oh why, must you call me dumb, OM? Because I asked a simple question? The person that made that "racist remark" apologized and said that it being a racist remark was not intended. I for one don't think they needed to apologize; racism was not their intent. But you made damn sure to imply it was their intent, didn't you?

Once again, you have to spin it all around to suit your agenda. I, for one, think that you brought it up again to garner support (think affection here) for yourself. Really, why would someone resurrect something like that other than to attract attention? It was a mute point and everyone here (except YOU) accepted it as such. And even though I asked a simple question, you had to "attack" again, didn't you? Well, I can tell you this OM; dumb I am not. I might not have all the fancy degrees you do. But, neither do I need a piece of paper to tell me how smart I am. You can't help but throw insults towards anyone that disagrees with you or asks a simple question for which you don't have an intelligent response. Yep, keep slinging them mud pies.

Have a nice night!

I sling cow pies, not mud pies by the way. yoB, I never claimed I was angel...

I too prefer outdoor recreation. Do we really need a building at this point in time at all? We live in Idaho where most of the population spends time outdoors due to the mild climate. Why does this entire facility center on keeping people indoors as opposed to outside?

I have changed my mind on this WREC. I believe all Y involvement has been "structured" as far as who will provide input and I do not support this board or any part of the plan any longer. I think it is all a sham to get the pools. I am ready to vote.

I have no idea yoB but I can tell you that most of the people I know spend their time outside as opposed to inside. Yes, I do know it gets hot and I do know it gets cold. I am out in the climate year round, working. If it is 105 degrees, the grass still needs to be cut and weeds pulled. If it is 5 degrees with 70 mile winds for 2 days, animals still need to be taken care of. So yes, I am aware of the climate.

As far as my comments regarding a "representative" of the WECRD...I will continue as it is what she said...in print and went on to say oh so much more after that. Try to focus for a moment on that. Not very smart considering the condition of the WECRD at this time but then Beth is just that way and not all that smart. yoB, you have made your fair share of attacks as well based of your feelings about me and others---not fact. There is a huge difference young one between the 2. So, you can remind me of my words (which I know what I have said) but be ready when yours come back at you. Have a nice day.

Now, regarding education in this community. Why is yoB allowed so much computer time while in school where she should be doing her school work? Would the bond have fixed that as well because it would appear there are more than enough computers for the time you spend in school, on a blog with the head of that school watching you and commenting. So, pardon me if I fail to see just how much that bond was really needed if you can spend your days messing around (while at school) on a computer. That is not what we pay taxes for.

"MM, I did not call you dumb."

OM, you're talking semantics here: You implied it, silly. (and no, you're response didn't clear anything up for me; except to strengthen my belief that you are definitely on the edge)

And please, do tell what I have misrepresented to fit any kind of agenda whatsoever. Seriously, I'm really curious. The fact that you might have misrepresented things to fit your "twisted little agenda" is not an excuse to accuse others of doing the same.

"Sorry for such a racist remark hardly makes it right. Sorry if I fail to see that "sorry" as the least bit sincere."

Once again, I don't think the intent of racism existed. You brought it back up out of the blue, for whatever reason I have no idea. Really, think about it: Something was said, misconstrued, then apologized for, left for naught, and 2 months later its ugly head is reared again. Something cries "attention" here.

"Funny, you hold all that is said against a certain person and track him like a blood hound (not that he does not need it mind you)."

If you ever had your life threatened in a roundabout way, I would expect no less from you also: To "track" the individual that threatened you.

How you "feel" about someone versus a bonafide threat are 2 completely different situations.

I still really want to know what work you have done at the high school?

Oh, I never saw your answer before. I hope you sub at the high school next year. Particularly the journalism classes. Or even, in one of the trailers. I wonder if you will have to send one of the freshmen to go to the bathroom in the pouring rain...?

Attention all,

Never wrestle with a pig...you'll both get dirty, and the pig likes it.

Hey yoB, back in the day...a school house had only one room with no boiler/furnace for heat. Oh, and you had to leave the building to go potty...in an outhouse (where it was cold in the winter and hot in the summer). I feel your pain regarding how hard it all is for you. You poor, poor thing. Why have your parents not sent you to one of those fancy prep schools in Boise so that you could get a "better" education? Probably because they see little wrong with the system here (it is what you make of it). Wait, what good does that do if all you do is sit on a computer all day and blog when you should be LEARNING? Pardon me if I do not want to pay MORE taxes for such things. You are yet another perfect example of what is wrong with education and why I am glad I did NOT vote for the bond. Then, you would have more computers and newer computers in a new classroom and still mess around. You poor, 3rd world country educated young person. Yep, I do feel bad for you...when you hit the "real" world and see what it is really all about. Then, maybe some of us "oldies" will make more sense to you. If I did have you in my class, I can bet you that you would not be on that computer, on a blog, while on my dime. School is to learn not mess around on a computer all day no matter how smart you are. I am sure your blog comments will be used at a future bond meeting to make more points with school admin. Thank you for that.

Good point junkyard. Thank you.

Man I sure love coming on this site, it's cheap entertainment! I love how you guys just all of a sudden went from the WECRD, to yoB spending too much time on the computer.

I believe it says:

Your Comments:

Please be respectful (which none of us do, yes even you yoB) of others and TRY TO STAY ON TOPIC.

I hate to say this, but its her blog...I agree wtih OM, but save all the "bashing" for the BB on the main page.

Shssssh! Everyone be very very quiet while missythang puts together a response filled with vulgar & profane references.

the_untouchable2k9

Bite me!

untouchable... the topic change was a random action of Ms. lauric. She just thinks it's unproductive and noneducational for me to discuss/debate/argue these important issues. I wouldn't be surprised if somehow there is a complaint called into the school and the MHN website is blocked by the beginning of the next school year.

yeah I know, a teacher in middle school used to let us chat with people who were in the room! =D And about the blocked sites... oh I know. I used to get in trouble every day in 9th grade for going to proxy blockers. harmless fun....

"I think she has a lot more fun trying to tear down things that others work to obtain.-posted by BB on her opinion of OM"

YOU HIT THE NAIL SQUARE ON THE HEAD! I don't believe for one moment (the few represented by OM) worked toward discussion with this board. It seems to me from the way they present themselves it was always ATTACK, TEAR DOWN, AND CRITICIZE, those who stepped up and are willing to work toward this goal.

I have witnessed that true public opinion at these types of proceedings does have an effect. I can only surmise that it was never put to the board in a reasonable manner or the right points or questions asked... my feelings is they went in there on the attack and TOLD the board something like "you are idiots, we don't need a pool. stupid making your own agenda gollie its mollie" stuff like that.

Let's see what happens between now and Nov., then let's see if OM gets her way. By everything she has written she is the end all power of the proposed nov vote. as far as her rhetoric: I hear blah blah blah blah it's personal against Mollie and certain volunteers, blah blah blah blah. IMO, OM has no altruistic intent, just egoistic.